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Bots plays against skilled players?..


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mrrrLeopard #1 Posted 13 May 2022 - 12:55 AM

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I lost.

balancer.jpg

 

Just look at the pilots points of both sides!..

And its not a first time!


Edited by mrrrLeopard, 13 May 2022 - 01:20 AM.


cobra_marksman #2 Posted 13 May 2022 - 01:28 AM

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That is a perfect example of a predetermined outcome already dialed in before the battle even begun.

You came in with a Ground attack plane vs his fighter.

All your bots were dialed in to stay in the 3000-point range.

His bots averaged in the 5000 -point range.

So, yea you were at a disadvantage (lousy bots) due to MM trying to balance the battle of a ...Gaa. vs a fighter.

It was you alone vs him & his better bots.... bottom line...you got screwed. :B



mrrrLeopard #3 Posted 13 May 2022 - 01:35 AM

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OK

View Postcobra_marksman, on 13 May 2022 - 01:28 AM, said:

That is a perfect example of a predetermined outcome already dialed in before the battle even begun.

You came in with a Ground attack plane vs his fighter.

All your bots were dialed in to stay in the 3000-point range.

His bots averaged in the 5000 -point range.

So, yea you were at a disadvantage (lousy bots) due to MM trying to balance the battle of a ...Gaa. vs a fighter.

It was you alone vs him & his better bots.... bottom line...you got screwed. :B

OK, then.

But where is his GA plane with 12K and where is MY fighter with 8-10k?

We was a both specialists. I can agree this loosing if points has some balance. But this is a SYSTEMATIC story!

You just try to make a smile near the corpse!



CorvusCorvax #4 Posted 13 May 2022 - 01:39 AM

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View PostmrrrLeopard, on 13 May 2022 - 12:55 AM, said:

I lost.

balancer.jpg

 

Just look at the pilots points of both sides!..

And its not a first time!

 

Without seeing the game replay, it's hard to know what actually happened.  A brain-dead LF pilot can spin at a central airbase in a loss and rack up 15000 personal points.  A smart light fighter pilot might make 12000PP, but be able to take 5 sectors, then defend the valuable ones to secure a win.  GAA pilots can own a battle, if they know where to be, and when.  Otherwise, just blowing stuff up will get PP, but not a victory.

 

View Postcobra_marksman, on 13 May 2022 - 01:28 AM, said:

That is a perfect example of a predetermined outcome already dialed in before the battle even begun.

LOL, no, that doesn't happen.  No matter how many times different people claim this, it still isn't true.


I might not be King of the Hill, but I am the Prince of Potatoes.

mrrrLeopard #5 Posted 13 May 2022 - 02:02 AM

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View PostCorvusCorvax, on 13 May 2022 - 01:39 AM, said:

  GAA pilots can own a battle, if they know where to be, and when.  Otherwise, just blowing stuff up will get PP, but not a victory.

 

Unfortunately, i know, where to be and then. i have my 24th place in all types of planes only on GAA and without a golden ammo etc. And im not a maniac timewaster, and play just in my free time.

So, you have a bad example.

top.jpg

ima bad fighter, but im the one of good gga on this server. But some bad times was started after cancelling to fly on near levels. and this is true!


Edited by mrrrLeopard, 13 May 2022 - 02:09 AM.


CorvusCorvax #6 Posted 13 May 2022 - 02:14 AM

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View PostmrrrLeopard, on 13 May 2022 - 02:02 AM, said:

 

Unfortunately, i know, where to be and then.

It appears that in this battle, that was not true.

You don't win 100% of the time, so that means that you lose every so often.  It may be that RNG was not good to you this battle - it happens when things add up and seem to favor the other team.  But surely you have had battle that you won in just a few minutes, where you and your bots just ran all over the other team.  Is it possible the the RNG added up those times in your favor?

The idea that the bots are out to get you or that the battles are rigged before the start is just utter nonsense.


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cobra_marksman #7 Posted 13 May 2022 - 02:15 AM

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View PostCorvusCorvax, on 12 May 2022 - 08:39 PM, said:

 

LOL, no, that doesn't happen.  No matter how many times different people claim this, it still isn't true.

Lol....you can't be serious, "Look at his Bots " are you blind...:facepalm:

All of his bots in a tier 10 match were held to an average 3000 points. :angry:( 3 of his bots never reached 3000 points, & not 1 with any chevrons )

Now lets look at the other side, Look at those Bots " they ALL were dialed in at 5000 to 6000 points.:ohmy: & ( 7 ) bots with chevrons.

So unless your blind or are just ignoring the obvious, their was a big difference in (11 )- 3000 point bots vs  (11 ) - 5000 to 6000 point bots.

By purposely mismatching those 22 bots they did in fact set up a battle to predetermine the outcome of the battle.

Hell, he was in a tier 10 Gaa, with 4 chevrons and a final score of 17000,:playing: the other player scored 10K with 2 chevrons.:facepalm:

The win should have clearly been his, but the Matchmaker before the battle begun decided differently by controlling the differences in the bots. :honoring:



mrrrLeopard #8 Posted 13 May 2022 - 02:25 AM

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View PostCorvusCorvax, on 13 May 2022 - 02:14 AM, said:

It appears that in this battle, that was not true.

You don't win 100% of the time, so that means that you lose every so often.  It may be that RNG was not good to you this battle - it happens when things add up and seem to favor the other team.  But surely you have had battle that you won in just a few minutes, where you and your bots just ran all over the other team.  Is it possible the the RNG added up those times in your favor?

The idea that the bots are out to get you or that the battles are rigged before the start is just utter nonsense.

You just don`t know how to read a words. Is i said im a bad fighter, and don`t like a dogfights, bustling, scurry etc. but quests is a quests, and i must to fly on this carousels. As you can see - if you divide my flights counter by 5 (types of planes) - i have a good results on my GAA:

balancer.jpg

And i see only this things as i can see. And this is true!


Edited by mrrrLeopard, 13 May 2022 - 02:32 AM.


mrrrLeopard #9 Posted 13 May 2022 - 02:27 AM

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View Postcobra_marksman, on 13 May 2022 - 02:15 AM, said:

Lol....you can't be serious, "Look at his Bots " are you blind...:facepalm:

All of his bots in a tier 10 match were held to an average 3000 points. :angry:( 3 of his bots never reached 3000 points, & not 1 with any chevrons )

Now lets look at the other side, Look at those Bots " they ALL were dialed in at 5000 to 6000 points.:ohmy: & ( 7 ) bots with chevrons.

So unless your blind or are just ignoring the obvious, their was a big difference in (11 )- 3000 point bots vs  (11 ) - 5000 to 6000 point bots.

By purposely mismatching those 22 bots they did in fact set up a battle to predetermine the outcome of the battle.

Hell, he was in a tier 10 Gaa, with 4 chevrons and a final score of 17000,:playing: the other player scored 10K with 2 chevrons.:facepalm:

The win should have clearly been his, but the Matchmaker before the battle begun decided differently by controlling the differences in the bots. :honoring:

YESSS!!!!!!!



12_inch_Hawk #10 Posted 13 May 2022 - 02:31 AM

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I have said it so many times I'm sick of saying it but I will say it again, points do not equal a win.  The most efficient way to win is to score the LEAST points necessary.  He must have taken the important sectors at the right times.  For example a GA can rack up a ton of points fighting over a white mine only to have it get flipped right back because now only one team is hitting ground targets instead of two.  When I am screwing around I will purposely shoot one target in a white sector and let red hit another so it goes back and forth never being captured.  You get lots of points but it is not conducive to winning.   I'm not suggesting you were doing that on purpose but I am using it to make the point that points do not equal wins.

 

There is no such thing as good or bad bots.  Bots score more when humans do better.  A human in a yak 30 killing all your bots means they are scoring less because they are spending more time out of the battle waiting to respawn.  Bots score less when the sectors are red because the blue bots have to fight the red bots AND the red ADA's.  Maybe all he did was kill ADA's (they give very little points) flipping sectors red making your bots fight his bots and ADA's.  

 

If you want to know what you did wrong and what the red human did better post the replay.  Posting points means NOTHING!



mrrrLeopard #11 Posted 13 May 2022 - 02:34 AM

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View Post12_inch_Hawk, on 13 May 2022 - 02:31 AM, said:

I have said it so many times I'm sick of saying it but I will say it again, points do not equal a win.  The most efficient way to win is to score the LEAST points necessary.  He must have taken the important sectors at the right times.  For example a GA can rack up a ton of points fighting over a white mine only to have it get flipped right back because now only one team is hitting ground targets instead of two.  When I am screwing around I will purposely shoot one target in a white sector and let red hit another so it goes back and forth never being captured.  You get lots of points but it is not conducive to winning.   I'm not suggesting you were doing that on purpose but I am using it to make the point that points do not equal wins.

 

There is no such thing as good or bad bots.  Bots score more when humans do better.  A human in a yak 30 killing all your bots means they are scoring less because they are spending more time out of the battle waiting to respawn.  Bots score less when the sectors are red because the blue bots have to fight the red bots AND the red ADA's.  Maybe all he did was kill ADA's (they give very little points) flipping sectors red making your bots fight his bots and ADA's.  

 

If you want to know what you did wrong and what the red human did better post the replay.  Posting points means NOTHING!

Its a wery good! But how about a bots? this is a point! I don`t fly alone!

Opponents are ashamed to win against me! This is fine?


Edited by mrrrLeopard, 13 May 2022 - 02:37 AM.


Ace_BOTlistic_Cosmo #12 Posted 13 May 2022 - 02:36 AM

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so... I was flipping this silver dollar with a guy

I bet him in ten flips I'd come up heads an well, he said tails

so we put $20 on each flip

well, 7 flips came up tails an 3 came in at heads

so, I owed the guy $80

.

.

.

the coin was clearly fixed before we started

I was going to beat his face in because it was his silver dollar

.

.

.

he just gave me my $80 back and called me a loser

yeah, right...

he was the cheater 

:coin:



12_inch_Hawk #13 Posted 13 May 2022 - 02:40 AM

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View PostmrrrLeopard, on 12 May 2022 - 09:34 PM, said:

Its a wery good! But how about a bots? this is a point! I don`t fly alone!

second paragraph I explained the bots 

 

You can either put on your tin foil hat and claim it is all just a big conspiracy against you or you can take responsibility for your own actions, your own failings, and your own successes.  You cant simultaneously claim the game is rigged and claim that you are a good GA player.  That's a contradiction, it has to be one or the other.  If your failings are because it is rigged than so are your successes.  Post the replay If I cant figure out what you did wrong or what he did better I will completely reverse my statements and admit it is just a conspiracy, random chance, or whatever else you want.  

 



Ace_BOTlistic_Cosmo #14 Posted 13 May 2022 - 02:42 AM

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View Post12_inch_Hawk, on 12 May 2022 - 09:40 PM, said:

second paragraph I explained the bots 

 

You can either put on your tin foil hat and claim it is all just a big conspiracy against you or you can take responsibility for your own actions, your own failings, and your own successes.  You cant simultaneously claim the game is rigged and claim that you are a good GA player.  That's a contradiction, it has to be one or the other.  If your failings are because it is rigged than so are your successes.  Post the replay If I cant figure out what you did wrong or what he did better I will completely reverse my statements and admit it is just a conspiracy, random chance, or whatever else you want.  

 

hey dude,

you want me to post the coin flipping replay

cus I will...

:facepalm:



mrrrLeopard #15 Posted 13 May 2022 - 02:59 AM

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View Post12_inch_Hawk, on 13 May 2022 - 02:40 AM, said:

second paragraph I explained the bots 

 

You can either put on your tin foil hat and claim it is all just a big conspiracy against you or you can take responsibility for your own actions, your own failings, and your own successes.  You cant simultaneously claim the game is rigged and claim that you are a good GA player.  That's a contradiction, it has to be one or the other.  If your failings are because it is rigged than so are your successes.  Post the replay If I cant figure out what you did wrong or what he did better I will completely reverse my statements and admit it is just a conspiracy, random chance, or whatever else you want.  

 

ha-ha-ha! Very funny! My replay can`t be played at this version of the game!

Do you have another arguments?


Edited by mrrrLeopard, 13 May 2022 - 03:01 AM.


12_inch_Hawk #16 Posted 13 May 2022 - 03:06 AM

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View PostmrrrLeopard, on 12 May 2022 - 09:59 PM, said:

ha-ha-ha! Very funny! My replay can`t be played at this version of the game!

Do you have another arguments?

replays are saved for 30 days by default.  close the game.  open your file folder.  go to videos, go to wowp,  select the battle right click and "open with" wowp.  



mrrrLeopard #17 Posted 13 May 2022 - 03:13 AM

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View Post12_inch_Hawk, on 13 May 2022 - 03:06 AM, said:

replays are saved for 30 days by default.  close the game.  open your file folder.  go to videos, go to wowp,  select the battle right click and "open with" wowp.  

Yes, i have a saved replay. BUT my replay can`t start and i have a warning message about hi can`t be played at current version of the game. i have more than 5K battles and i know how to start replays, but this game was wroten by... mans who don`t like replays.

but we all talk about this STANDART situation on picture, and all of us isnt surprised. Can you tell as why?


Edited by mrrrLeopard, 13 May 2022 - 03:21 AM.


12_inch_Hawk #18 Posted 13 May 2022 - 03:26 AM

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Here is a real world example of how a yak30 with no points wins against a GA with lots of points (and how his bots score better);

 

Take the 4 sector map with a garrison by each spawn, a central airbase, and a mine north of the airbase.  The yak 30 goes strait to the airbase at the start of the game.  he kills 3 ADA's to take the airbase.  As I stated earlier ADA give very little points. The blue GA takes the closest garrison hitting a lot of ground targets and getting a good number of points.  He does this fast preventing his bots from scoring any points.  The Blue GA than heads to the mine.  He is fighting over a white mine against red bots so he scores a lot of points.  The red yak 30 goes and takes the blue garrison.   It only takes another 3 ADA to flip the garrison and since it is already blue there is no back and forth like over a white sector.  So far the red yak 30 has only killed 6 ADA's but it is enough to win the game right there.  The red bots take the garrison next to the red spawn point because the blue bots cant get there without flying through the red airbase and getting engaged by the ADA.  When blue bots spawn in half go to the airbase and half go to the garrison next to the blue spawn point.  They cant get anywhere else because the yak 30 has created a bottleneck of red sectors.  The half of the blue bots that go to the airbase (half of 11 is 5 or 6) now have to fight 6 red ADA at the airbase plus the red bots and the human yak 30.  Its not that they are bad bots they are following the exact same algorithm as the red bots its just that the blue bots are out numbered 2-1 so of course they are going to die and not score as many points. The red bots even if they do die can spawn in right at the airport and right next to the mine.  With all the blue bots bottled up the red bot GA and bombers take the mine after the blue human GA takes it.  The blue GA after taking the mine tries to take the airport but he can shoot 3 ground targets and all it takes is for one blue bot to die and it means nothing.  The human blue GA racks up a ton of points hitting low value ground targets in the airport but it doesn't flip.  Red gets air supremacy as a result and all the YAK 30 had to do the entire game was kill 6 ADA which isn't a lot of points..  


Edited by 12_inch_Hawk, 13 May 2022 - 03:31 AM.


mrrrLeopard #19 Posted 13 May 2022 - 03:35 AM

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View Post12_inch_Hawk, on 13 May 2022 - 03:26 AM, said:

Here is a real world example of how a yak30 with no points wins against a GA with lots of points (and how his bots score better);

 

We all can emagine how it was. But your speach don`t explain a systematical situation with bots whoes don`t fight but go to the rocks or just fly for flying and meditation. Your words don`t explain this disbalance of points results of bots.



12_inch_Hawk #20 Posted 13 May 2022 - 03:37 AM

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View PostmrrrLeopard, on 12 May 2022 - 10:35 PM, said:

We all can emagine how it was. But your speach don`t explain a systematical situation with bots whoes don`t fight but go to the rocks or just fly for flying and meditation. Your words don`t explain this disbalance of points results of bots.

English isn't your first language is it?






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