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RedLeg03 #1 Posted 14 September 2021 - 03:01 PM

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I’ve been following the forums for a little while and noticed that most complaints are about 1. match making and 2. low human to bot ratio.

 

I have also read several folks point out that WG’s attempts to improve in these areas have only made the game more blasé (most recently getting rid of split tier flights) or disjointed (offering really great premium aircraft a la the Goose and the SuperFortress).

 

Why doesn’t WG just introduce AI bots?

 

How hard would it be to give AI bots accounts?  Statistics?  Ability to respond in game?  Human-player-like names?  Clan leadership roles?

 

Here’s my question:  If you rolled into a match and couldn’t tell the difference between bots and humans, and the matches seemed completely filled with humans, multiple flights even, winged and unwinged…

 

WHAT WOULD YOU COMPLAIN ABOUT THEN?

 

Just curious



Mudguts_ #2 Posted 14 September 2021 - 03:06 PM

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View PostRedLeg03, on 14 September 2021 - 10:01 AM, said:

 

WHAT WOULD YOU COMPLAIN ABOUT THEN?

 

Ramming


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RedLeg03 #3 Posted 14 September 2021 - 03:13 PM

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View PostMudguts_, on 14 September 2021 - 03:06 PM, said:

 

Ramming


Every week I see a couple of those on the roads.  Backs up traffic.  Very frustrating!



ItsSubmersible #4 Posted 14 September 2021 - 04:50 PM

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View PostRedLeg03, on 14 September 2021 - 10:01 AM, said:

I’ve been following the forums for a little while and noticed that most complaints are about 1. match making and 2. low human to bot ratio.

 

I have also read several folks point out that WG’s attempts to improve in these areas have only made the game more blasé (most recently getting rid of split tier flights) or disjointed (offering really great premium aircraft a la the Goose and the SuperFortress).

 

Why doesn’t WG just introduce AI bots?

 

How hard would it be to give AI bots accounts?  Statistics?  Ability to respond in game?  Human-player-like names?  Clan leadership roles?

 

Here’s my question:  If you rolled into a match and couldn’t tell the difference between bots and humans, and the matches seemed completely filled with humans, multiple flights even, winged and unwinged…

 

WHAT WOULD YOU COMPLAIN ABOUT THEN?

 

Just curious


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Trauglodyte #5 Posted 14 September 2021 - 05:47 PM

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The bots are only a problem because they're stupid.  Or, if you'd prefer, the bot programming is weak, especially in regards to GAA and bombers.  I've seen two GAA and a bomber spend over 5 minutes plinking away at a Mining Facility and never take it.  What makes it worse is that, despite what Blindfold says (which I don't disagree with the "levels of capabilities"), s/he never indicated whether each bot, per game, has the same spec/equipment/capability.  We have all seen games go sideway, for no reason other than bots acting like Keystone Cops, Benny Hill, Three Stooges, etc.

 

As I see it, it isn't that I know that the enemy players are bots.  Though, I'd find it comical, if WarGaming introduced rng names for all players until the end of the game, like the incognito mode in WoT.  The problem is not knowing if you're going to get the super Winged Legend bot or a bot that, at the end of the game, barely broke 1k personal points after receiving 1k personal points for free.



Captain_Underpants53 #6 Posted 14 September 2021 - 07:07 PM

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It won't happen.  Bots are notoriously stingy with their spending.
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losttwo #7 Posted 14 September 2021 - 09:29 PM

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View PostCaptain_Underpants53, on 14 September 2021 - 02:07 PM, said:

It won't happen.  Bots are notoriously stingy with their spending.

 

If you want to overcome the " OMG, you got the super bots "~Wongway Pollo42 ConwayMarco style play

Then just simply offer them oil at start of battle and turn it into a 800-0 WIN

Or WD-40 works good too

 



SkyWolf__WM #8 Posted 14 September 2021 - 10:04 PM

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View PostRedLeg03, on 14 September 2021 - 10:01 AM, said:

Why doesn’t WG just introduce AI bots?

 

How hard would it be to give AI bots accounts?  Statistics?  Ability to respond in game?  Human-player-like names?  Clan leadership roles?

 

Here’s my question:  If you rolled into a match and couldn’t tell the difference between bots and humans, and the matches seemed completely filled with humans, multiple flights even, winged and unwinged…

 

WHAT WOULD YOU COMPLAIN ABOUT THEN?

 

Just curious

 

Literally everything you suggested. :teethhappy:


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aquabat #9 Posted 14 September 2021 - 10:46 PM

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What exactly do you think the bots are, if not AI?

losttwo #10 Posted 14 September 2021 - 10:58 PM

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View Postaquabat, on 14 September 2021 - 05:46 PM, said:

What exactly do you think the bots are, if not AI?

 

They certainly are not intelligent. 

They are programmed and not self actualizing. 

They do not learn to respond to stimuli

 



aquabat #11 Posted 14 September 2021 - 11:18 PM

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View Postlosttwo, on 14 September 2021 - 10:58 PM, said:

 

They certainly are not intelligent. 

They are programmed and not self actualizing. 

They do not learn to respond to stimuli

 


Neither of which is a prerequisite for something to be considered an AI.



losttwo #12 Posted 14 September 2021 - 11:40 PM

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View Postaquabat, on 14 September 2021 - 06:18 PM, said:


Neither of which is a prerequisite for something to be considered an AI.

so you mean they are like the programmers

They just pretending to be intelligent



aquabat #13 Posted 14 September 2021 - 11:48 PM

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View Postlosttwo, on 14 September 2021 - 11:40 PM, said:

so you mean they are like the programmers

They just pretending to be intelligent


Slightly above programmers, in terms of intelligence.

I'd say somewhere in between a bureaucrat and a toddler.


Edited by aquabat, 14 September 2021 - 11:49 PM.


Viper_7242NC #14 Posted 15 September 2021 - 12:03 AM

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View Postlosttwo, on 14 September 2021 - 05:58 PM, said:

 

They certainly are not intelligent. 

They are programmed and not self actualizing. 

They do not learn to respond to stimuli

 

 

They do. If you put rounds into a bot and don't kill them, they will target you. I'm sure it is part of their programming.


 
So say we all.

Trauglodyte #15 Posted 15 September 2021 - 03:31 PM

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View Postlosttwo, on 14 September 2021 - 10:58 PM, said:

 

They certainly are not intelligent. 

They are programmed and not self actualizing. 

They do not learn to respond to stimuli

 

 

They're pre-programmed to operate based upon a specific decision tree.  That decision tree changes, the second squall line kicks in.  The problematic part is that they don't learn, so it isn't AI or machine learning but just a decision tree (as said), and there isn't anything that changes that decision tree, based upon the cascade failure of the game.  Plus, there is no beefing up of bots, based upon human stats and gear and/or the continued face planting, of that bot.  Case in point, I've had bots that ended games with 1100 Personal Points, of which 1k of those 1100 PPs are given as an end-game bonus.  That bot kept getting splatting and it never changed performance parameters or programming.

 

All of the above, would be WAY too much to ask for a FPS game that has this low of a population.  They could do things, that would make the bot interaction better.  But, this all comes down to a "cost benefit" analysis and the benefit isn't there.



losttwo #16 Posted 15 September 2021 - 04:51 PM

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View PostTrauglodyte, on 15 September 2021 - 10:31 AM, said:

 

They're pre-programmed to operate based upon a specific decision tree.  That decision tree changes, the second squall line kicks in.  The problematic part is that they don't learn, so it isn't AI or machine learning but just a decision tree (as said), and there isn't anything that changes that decision tree, based upon the cascade failure of the game.  Plus, there is no beefing up of bots, based upon human stats and gear and/or the continued face planting, of that bot.  Case in point, I've had bots that ended games with 1100 Personal Points, of which 1k of those 1100 PPs are given as an end-game bonus.  That bot kept getting splatting and it never changed performance parameters or programming.

 

All of the above, would be WAY too much to ask for a FPS game that has this low of a population.  They could do things, that would make the bot interaction better.  But, this all comes down to a "cost benefit" analysis and the benefit isn't there.

exactly

it is nothing more that1980's Basic programming of " if > then " statements



Bluegoose02 #17 Posted 15 September 2021 - 05:29 PM

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First your looking at it the wrong way . First you have to make something people want . If you don't put in the time and money into it first nothing will change.

First you make a good product then people buy . You don't put out s--t and then fix it later.



Flushmaster #18 Posted 15 September 2021 - 06:03 PM

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View PostBluegoose02, on 15 September 2021 - 12:29 PM, said:

First your looking at it the wrong way . First you have to make something people want . If you don't put in the time and money into it first nothing will change.

First you make a good product then people buy . You don't put out s--t and then fix it later.

If the product is so bad then you must either enjoy wasting your time or you are mentally deficient for doing something you just said is undesirable. 



Bluegoose02 #19 Posted 15 September 2021 - 06:26 PM

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I didn't say it was that bad , I said if they want more people they have to improve it first not wait till they have a bigger player base.

 



qu33kKC #20 Posted 16 September 2021 - 11:15 AM

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View PostBluegoose02, on 15 September 2021 - 05:29 PM, said:

 You don't put out s--t and then fix it later.

 

Bethesda sez "hold my Nuka-Cola!"


Edited by qu33kKC, 16 September 2021 - 11:20 AM.





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