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Change my mind, 2.0 improved the game

2.0 better game

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Lose_dudes #1 Posted 06 April 2021 - 02:11 PM

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Most of the people I see wanting 1.9 back either have very few battles, or are very experienced. Most of you have no idea how frustrating it is to be sent back to the hangar after being killed. I play wot infrequently, mostly because I have no option to improve. I just go into battle, die, then go back to die in a different tank again. Wowp lets you respawn, and you can gain tactical superiority even while dying. It lets you make a difference and actually improve. 

Just my 2 credits, take it with a grain of salt


Destroyers? In my day, we only had torpedo boats!

losttwo #2 Posted 06 April 2021 - 02:30 PM

    which way do we go?

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This is nothing more than an opinion post based on what people want out of a game, 

 

Both game iterations of pre-1.4 and the present 2.0 are both equal in favoritism based on a persons perception

of what they desire out of a game, 

 

I very much enjoyed the game pre 1.4 and found it more challenging. 

I very much enjoy the game in it's 2.0+ configuration due to it's less challenging aspect. 



jack_wdw #3 Posted 06 April 2021 - 02:45 PM

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View PostLose_dudes, on 06 April 2021 - 02:11 PM, said:

Most of the people I see wanting 1.9 back either have very few battles, or are very experienced. Most of you have no idea how frustrating it is to be sent back to the hangar after being killed. I play wot infrequently, mostly because I have no option to improve. I just go into battle, die, then go back to die in a different tank again. Wowp lets you respawn, and you can gain tactical superiority even while dying. It lets you make a difference and actually improve. 

Just my 2 credits, take it with a grain of salt


The dying thing, made it harder to get to Tier X, meaning more learning time for newbs in the lower tiers.
The dying thing, made you fly nearly every plane in your hanger.
For me personally deathmatch felt more like chess, conquest feels more like checkers.

 



losttwo #4 Posted 06 April 2021 - 02:48 PM

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king me

Lose_dudes #5 Posted 06 April 2021 - 02:51 PM

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View Postjack_wdw, on 06 April 2021 - 02:45 PM, said:


The dying thing, made it harder to get to Tier X, meaning more learning time for newbs in the lower tiers.
The dying thing, made you fly nearly every plane in your hanger.
For me personally deathmatch felt more like chess, conquest feels more like checkers.

 

...while learning absolutely nothing. Hop in, die, hop back out again, at the end you got maybe 200 xp and didn't get any better at your plane.


Destroyers? In my day, we only had torpedo boats!

Captain_Underpants53 #6 Posted 06 April 2021 - 03:03 PM

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View PostLose_dudes, on 06 April 2021 - 09:51 AM, said:

...while learning absolutely nothing. Hop in, die, hop back out again, at the end you got maybe 200 xp and didn't get any better at your plane.

Speak for yourself!  Oh, you are.  (my bad)


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Ace_BOTlistic_Cosmo #7 Posted 06 April 2021 - 03:15 PM

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View Postlosttwo, on 06 April 2021 - 09:48 AM, said:

king me

how do you joker (or clown) someone in checkers?

:facepalm:


Edited by Ace_BOTlistic_Cosmo, 06 April 2021 - 03:16 PM.

if the pilot's good, see, I mean, if he's really..sharp, he can barrel that baby in so low [he spreads his arms like wings and laughs],

you oughtta see it sometime, it's a sight. A big plane like a '52. VRROOM! There's jet exhaust, fryin' chickens in the barnyard.


CorvusCorvax #8 Posted 06 April 2021 - 03:28 PM

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View PostCaptain_Underpants53, on 06 April 2021 - 03:03 PM, said:

Speak for yourself!  Oh, you are.  (my bad)

Exactly.



losttwo #9 Posted 06 April 2021 - 03:32 PM

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View PostAce_BOTlistic_Cosmo, on 06 April 2021 - 10:15 AM, said:

how do you joker (or clown) someone in checkers?

:facepalm:

You toss a rubber chicken on the board to distract them from you reaching across the table and putting your hand around their throat:playing:



DrSinister #10 Posted 06 April 2021 - 03:41 PM

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And you can say, some hated pre 1.0 also, that was back when there was ammo limits, wreckage can still kill, altitude was not compressed, in game pilots had a view cone, if you did not see a plane in that cone they were not spotted, did not have shotgun effect shooting, where evading you could survived and not get hit by a bullet, tails and wings could get torn off with 1 shot from a 30 mm.  Granted back then it was still arcade but had many simulation aspects.

I enjoyed pre 1.0, pre 2.0, but I also did not play much from 1.6 to 1.9 anyways, so post 2.0 not playing much was due to many factors before 2.0 even showed up.  Post 2.0 is a different game and I probably could get into it, idk to tell you the truth.

Many, now enjoyed 2.0.  I think more of what the other thread was more to see if just bringing back TDM gameplay would bring back some vets, since many vets that is what they liked TDM and no bots.  I understand the need for bots here due to the lack of players, but I know back in Closed Beta we have over 5k players in NA, hell, RU had over 50K players, at off peak hours it was hard to find full 15vs15 matches, but we had them, we even suggest to make full matches then 9v9 ( 3 full flights on back then).  I do miss the days when it was me vs 3-7 players and pulling out a win or a draw.  Yes, I have had 1 time where it was me vs 7 players and I evaded long enough to take very little damage and whittled them down till it was 1 vs 1 and granted it ended up as a draw.

I understand dying and returning to hanger sucks but for this domination gameplay respawning is needed. But I bet if they brought back TDM into this version respawns can still work, just like in other games in this style, just have to have a Max kill and/or match time. 

WhoaBlackBetty #11 Posted 06 April 2021 - 03:54 PM

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EDIT A multi quote I clicked on did not come across, and I totally disagree with what I posted.  Will try again.


Edited by WhoaBlackBetty, 06 April 2021 - 08:09 PM.

De-arse your bunks! Man the planes! The Fokkers are in sight! BAM ba LAMMM!
J311yfish: " 'Seal clubbing' and 'head hunting' are an inseparable part of the competitive nature of the game, and both provide a valuable service."
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Jaguardian #12 Posted 06 April 2021 - 07:20 PM

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Some people like rice pudding and not tapioca pudding and vice versa, some may like both.  I don't think you get punished enough for getting shot down in 2.0 so I like the previous version better.  It is really just a matter of personal opinion, but the fact that bots are needed is an indication the game is not what it should be, and WG seems to be happy with bot battles so they don't even try to improve the game anymore.

Jaguardian #13 Posted 06 April 2021 - 07:44 PM

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View PostLose_dudes, on 06 April 2021 - 08:51 AM, said:

...while learning absolutely nothing. Hop in, die, hop back out again, at the end you got maybe 200 xp and didn't get any better at your plane.

 

The players that wanted to improve would watch the good player that stayed alive and did well in the match and learn from them.  What's better, learning from your own experience, or watching an experienced player and learning from them?  Back then when you watched another player, you could maneuver the camera around and really see the full picture.



WhoaBlackBetty #14 Posted 06 April 2021 - 08:10 PM

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View PostLose_dudes, on 06 April 2021 - 08:51 AM, said:

...while learning absolutely nothing. Hop in, die, hop back out again, at the end you got maybe 200 xp and didn't get any better at your plane.

 

View PostCaptain_Underpants53, on 06 April 2021 - 09:03 AM, said:

Speak for yourself!  Oh, you are.  (my bad)

 

View PostCorvusCorvax, on 06 April 2021 - 09:28 AM, said:

Exactly.

And Bam Ba Lam.


De-arse your bunks! Man the planes! The Fokkers are in sight! BAM ba LAMMM!
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trikke #15 Posted 06 April 2021 - 09:58 PM

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respawns were the only attraction for WT, at the time that i left wowp     

 

i knew this system, had a bunch of planes, gold, etc and knew absolutely nothing about WT, other than respawns      

 

but still wasn't enough to keep me       i wasn't good enough to live longer than a few minutes, even though i'd been here since alpha

 

came back when 2.0 arrived          wouldn't fly 1.x again, even if it came back       i fly better now, thanks to respawns

 

 

 

 


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losttwo #16 Posted 06 April 2021 - 10:01 PM

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View PostJaguardian, on 06 April 2021 - 02:44 PM, said:

 

The players that wanted to improve would watch the good player that stayed alive and did well in the match and learn from them.  What's better, learning from your own experience, or watching an experienced player and learning from them?  Back then when you watched another player, you could maneuver the camera around and really see the full picture.


Unlike many of us veterans some people are not smarter than a 5th grader.



GeorgePatton #17 Posted 06 April 2021 - 11:06 PM

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View PostLose_dudes, on 06 April 2021 - 09:51 AM, said:

...while learning absolutely nothing. Hop in, die, hop back out again, at the end you got maybe 200 xp and didn't get any better at your plane.

 

Been here since (literally) day one of testing. We had over 12K people on the NA server at peak times during testing. WoWP was 2012's 'most anticipated title'. Then the developers decided to rebuild the game using RNG and eliminating most aspects of player skill. The game lost 95% of its popularity basically overnight. Everything since then has been a desperate attempt by WG to salvage the mess they made without going back to the original vision for the game because WG seems to believe that the average video game player is not up to the challenge of a competitive game.

 

Could it be brutal getting matched against skilled pilots? Absolutely. Could you learn? Yes - you just had to be willing to analyze your own performance and learn from your mistakes. You could also get to know the good players and they were almost always willing to pick up someone who demonstrated a willingness to learn and fly with them in a 3-player flight to teach them the basics of team play and air combat in general. WG also decided that 3-player flights shouldn't be part of the game in a strong departure from the rest of the trilogy's 3-play groups.

 

Then you had the decision to drop clan wars from the development plans which would have given the super-competitive players something to do other than randoms all day...

 

Bottom line is WG destroyed the potential of the game and the mess we have now is their (failing) attempt to salvage what's left. Sure, there are maybe 500 players in the NA region that like the game, but remember we had over 12K concurrently during testing and it was 2012's most anticipated title... To say that 2.0+ is better than anything pre-1.4 demonstrates a lack of knowledge about the game's development. There is a market for a game like pre-1.4 WoWP - somebody just needs to capitalize on it.

 

 

Cheers!
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GeorgePatton #18 Posted 06 April 2021 - 11:09 PM

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Oh, forgot to mention - I think a CoD-esque TDM would be better than this 'conquest' stuff and also more fun for the casual player than pre-2.0 TDM. I don't have a problem with respawns at all as long as they make the 'Ace' achievement 5 kills in a single sortie. 20 kills for Ace is just silly. Historically it was 5 kills, every other video game I know is 5 kills. 20 makes no sense.

 

 

Cheers!
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aquabat #19 Posted 07 April 2021 - 01:28 AM

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View PostGeorgePatton, on 06 April 2021 - 11:06 PM, said:

 

Been here since (literally) day one of testing. We had over 12K people on the NA server at peak times during testing. WoWP was 2012's 'most anticipated title'. Then the developers decided to rebuild the game using RNG and eliminating most aspects of player skill. The game lost 95% of its popularity basically overnight. Everything since then has been a desperate attempt by WG to salvage the mess they made without going back to the original vision for the game because WG seems to believe that the average video game player is not up to the challenge of a competitive game.

 

Could it be brutal getting matched against skilled pilots? Absolutely. Could you learn? Yes - you just had to be willing to analyze your own performance and learn from your mistakes. You could also get to know the good players and they were almost always willing to pick up someone who demonstrated a willingness to learn and fly with them in a 3-player flight to teach them the basics of team play and air combat in general. WG also decided that 3-player flights shouldn't be part of the game in a strong departure from the rest of the trilogy's 3-play groups.

 

Then you had the decision to drop clan wars from the development plans which would have given the super-competitive players something to do other than randoms all day...

 

Bottom line is WG destroyed the potential of the game and the mess we have now is their (failing) attempt to salvage what's left. Sure, there are maybe 500 players in the NA region that like the game, but remember we had over 12K concurrently during testing and it was 2012's most anticipated title... To say that 2.0+ is better than anything pre-1.4 demonstrates a lack of knowledge about the game's development. There is a market for a game like pre-1.4 WoWP - somebody just needs to capitalize on it.

 

 

Cheers!
Glenn

 

I believe their major problem there was, from the perspective of someone who loved the game back then, for some reason, was that they had to cater to the windowlicker gentleperson that came from WoT every time WG did one of those "come test wowp" things they did.

 

I don't know of any big exodus before open beta, but I do remember the discussion we all had when they implemented the camera we have now. I do remember that caused some players to leave.

 

Then I don't remember many alpha testers who supported that decision (I do remember you were amongst the ones that did). Most testers I remember, especially the very good players like haswell, colin_s, toggle, and so on, heavily criticized WG when it introduced flights. That also caused some players to leave.

 

Then came pilot skills, and that was it for a lot of people, myself included.

 

Then, for launch, they decided that the smart thing to do was to allow people who had been testing for what, six, nine months, to keep their skills after release, which combined with the flight model at release, which greatly privileged BnZ, meant that someone with that engine skill back then end a couple of others would dominate completely.

 

All in all though, I agree with you that WG made everything in their power to destroy this game based on the wrong perception that people were not sticking around because the game was too hard.

 


trikke #20 Posted 07 April 2021 - 01:52 PM

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"make it easier for new folks to live longer, so that they'll spend money to live even longer"       

 

it's hard to argue with that, around the discussion table         more money is a pretty effective way to change dev's minds     

 

 


Spittoon says #smarterpilotswinmore       





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