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Why I think this game needs a lot... and so little...


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DamienSked #1 Posted 03 September 2019 - 12:05 PM

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This game isn't bad. In fact, it's almost good. Unfortunately it seems to be stuck in a negative feedback loop. Wargaming doesn't want to invest time and money because it doesn't make enough revenue to be worth it. Many players don't want to invest time or money because it's unbalanced and buggy as hell. Plus the documentation is horrible and the interface, while I understand the intentions, has some issues. I'm a bit buzzed so going to type to much, so I will section this out to hopefully make an easier read.

 

Why I feel my opinion is valid

I've been gaming since the 80's staring with an Amiga 500 and then an NES. As the consoles came out, either me or one of my friends on the block up to my military room mates owned every single one up to PS2. I'm not the best gamer ever, but I've experienced all types. My first internet experience was in 1992 Prodigy followed quickly by dial up AOL. I've got history with these things. I've played a little bit of everything. From F/A-18 Interceptor to Blades of Steel. Monkey Island to PUBG. If its a game I'll give it a try. Except Fortnight. Tried it once... never again.

 

I'm a new player to WOWP. Of my 1236 battle played, about 1200 are within the last 60 days. I played when it was new as well as Warthunder. They both started around the same time. Warthunder only had planes while Wargaming was coming from tanks. As for aircraft, Warthunder was the better game by far so I played the hell out of that. Now Wargaming's World of series vs Warthunder is just arcade vs simulation gameplay. One isn't better than the other, jsut for different types of gamers. Like Need for Speed/Crazy Taxi vs Gran Turismo/Dirt.

 

Ships tried the CV rework gambit to try to get more players. I think their metrics for success are stupid, but I don't know the final numbers. The clan I played with pretty much died with that. Many already played WOT but most decided to give WOWP a try. They mostly liked WOWP and some even spent decent money (one with less than 500 battles has 2 T8, 2 T5, a T4, a T3, and a T2 Premium aircraft. He has money to spend and is definitely a whale in WOT and WOWS. He was on his way to being a whale in WOWP, but like almost everyone else associated with that clan, could only stand the imbalance and bugs for so long. now he only plays WOT. You need to fix this to make more money WG. Many of the people I currently play with don't want to invest the money because of this. They find it fun but. because of bugs, inconsistent and won't spend money.

 

Fix Bugs and Reliability

This is the number one thing that needs to happen in this game. I reported a few bugs I had in this forum and was quickly told by another player that those are already known. The problem is that there a too many known bugs that too many people have. Most new player aren't going to research fixes for these(e.g press enter twice to fix spawning with your camera following the another aircraft) and many you just have to live with (e.g. Daily Missions not updating properly, Weekly crate days changing at inconsistent times). 

 

Not being able to connect to the Hangar server after a battle is another major one. Don't take players out of the game involuntarily. No one likes that.

 

Fix the Interface

This is the second thing that needs work. I understand the minimalist interface. It's good for new players as to not overwhelm them with numbers and icons all over the screen. But even with this interface there are a lot of things that are counter intuitive. Progress bars for ordinance that reset when EMPTY? That's just confusing. The more useful numbers being hidden behind a button you have to hold with default bindings. Minor annoyance. To change that that to a toggle you have to to try to rebind the key to get the option to switch from Hold to Toggle. Stupidly hidden useful feature. Having the default binding for a useful feature be set to Alt while other useful features are set to F-keys. Very dumb idea. Alt + F4 should NEVER be a key combination the player wants to press for any reason except to rage quit.

 

This paragraph mostly not very high priority, but needs some real consideration. Especially the Alt+ F4 thing. You have a (not very easy to find {not hard either}) option to change what is shown on the alternative interface. But there's not much point. Every option there are things that players will either always want to see, or never want to see. What should be there are all the things that alternative interface enables such as Enemy Aircraft Heading vs Enemy Aircraft type. Having to spam through to get all the information to make good decisions is bad. Give players more chose of what shows on what interface.

 

Fix Balance

The is the third thing that needs fixing, but parts should be done with the first list of bug fixing. Because of low-mid tier bot matches, average win rate should be above %50, but I see far too many players around %40 as well as far too many above %60. Some planes are OP. Specialization makes them even more OP That should be addressed. My favorite so far is the T5 Hurricane II. It has guns that are the same (except over heat time) as the T6. The T6 can kill T7's with little difficulty. But my Hurricane 2 could dominate games before it was Specialized. There's way too much balance on Aircraft ability and not player skill. I know WG can see this in their games since the WOWS CV rework status video showed the winrate balance metrics and they talked about balancing the game to narrow the player skill gap. Right now it feels like WOWP is unbalanced in multiple ways. Too many players don't know what to do with thier aircraft (like focusing on to shoot ground targets at a mining plant in a fighter). As well as some aircraft are just bad while others will just destroy everything.

 

Match-making balance Also, take a poll of your players. Not just on the forums because plenty of players don't use them. But take a poll of you players on matchmaking times. I wouldn't mind waiting longer for a more balanced game. Most games are insanely one sided. It's just not fun if you keep ending up on the destroyed side of bad matchmaking. It's also pretty annoying trying to grind up a line, but you can't score very highly because you won too quickly. Even certain classes (Bombers and GAA) and medals (cough... EFIMOV) require a balanced game to be successful. I understand having some things be difficult. But having them be difficult after hoping RNG match-making give you chance at difficult is just frustrating.

 

Conclusion

If you read through this whole buzzed rant, thank you and I'm sorry. WG and WOWP staff. Fix the bugs and interface please. New features are nice, but they don't matter if leading to them are broken. When you get new players, they're not going to stick around very long to play a buggy game that they can't understand. Fix the balance. The new players won't stick around if they always lose. Here's a quick fix once you start getting more new players after the bug/interface fix. Reduce the daily requirements for low tiers. If the bug didn't discourage new players, losing to seal clubbers with specialized planes and 15 point pilots will. Don't encourage that kind of play by making it a requirement. This game is almost good. It doesn't have that big of a market share, but it looks like it can grow. There are plenty of people that don't like this game's highly successful competitor's one burst kills and overly complex loadout options. Give them a reliable alternative. Give players a reason to stay with the game once they get here. Then find more ways to get them here.



Maqor #2 Posted 03 September 2019 - 12:42 PM

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View PostDamienSked, on 03 September 2019 - 12:05 PM, said:

The new players won't stick around if they always lose. Here's a quick fix once you start getting more new players after the bug/interface fix. Reduce the daily requirements for low tiers. If the bug didn't discourage new players, losing to seal clubbers with specialized planes and 15 point pilots will. Don't encourage that kind of play by making it a requirement.

 

Personally, I stay out of tiers 1-3. I'd love it if the developers would restrict those tiers to new players somehow. Perhaps give a game limit for each low tier plane, like a max of 50 battles (or even less?) per low tier plane per account. That way you wouldn't have players with thousands of hours in the I-5 chasing away new players with their merciless sealclubbing.



SpiritFoxMY #3 Posted 03 September 2019 - 12:52 PM

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Unfortunately there are plenty of incentives to club seals even for people who would not normally stoop to that level - "daily" missions for one, requiring level 1 - 4 sections to complete. Not to mention it is easier to farm Mechanical Parts and Airframe Elements - two of the most sought after materials for upgrades - at tiers 1 - 3, not only because its easy to win at those tiers (and you only get material on wins) but also because 100% of the parts are guaranteed to be one of the two so you're going to be walking away with 5 - 8 parts at tiers 1 - 3 when you'd wind up with maybe 2 or 3 at higher tiers.

 

Maybe they could restrict the token and material rewards below tier 4. Maybe after 500 games, tier 1 - 4 dailies will no longer be available and you start getting less materials per win at those tiers. As it is, there are too many reasons for players to go down there and club the bejeezus out of newbies


***

But a truce to this mournful story

For death is a distant friend

So here's to a life of glory

And a laurel to crown each end


WhoaBlackBetty #4 Posted 03 September 2019 - 02:53 PM

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I like the ideas about how to get us vets out of the noob tiers, a lot.  I have to say though, there are not enough players down there to call it clubbing humans.  What you are clubbing are low tier bots and the game itself.  When we can get 5 to 10 humans every battle, then I will call it clubbing.

 

WBB



kasyut2207 #5 Posted 03 September 2019 - 03:07 PM

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I've been playing since I moved to an ASIA server, but I'm sick of bugs.
There are as many as 30 bugs currently discovered, some of which have been neglected since 2017.
At least I want a statement from the development team regarding bugs.

 

In addition, officially answered that there is no plan to create a forum in Asia.

https://twitter.com/...2915138560?s=19


Edited by kasyut2207, 07 September 2019 - 03:44 PM.


pyantoryng #6 Posted 03 September 2019 - 05:17 PM

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Interface customization was thrown away with 2.0 in an attempt of 'simplification' and has never been fully re-implemented. Radar altimeter never came back and most importantly, over target marker customization.

 

They did try, albeit half-heartedly (or even unconsciously), to funnel low tier players to the top end of low tier bracket (4) by not allowing achievements (and by extension tokens) and personal missions progress to be obtained in tier 1-3 and scaling up the payout as tier go up so the big EXP/silver grind is better done in as higher tier as possible in each range. While certain missions are better done with certain machines below tier 4, there's, IMO, hardly any incentive to go below 4 outside of mindless fun or some very specific objectives. Also, WG giving out slews of tier 2-3 premium in boxes and special occasions with at least one time coming with unique enhanced pilot to go along with it, is saying something.

 

There's literally nothing teaching players how to play and neither could the players learn on their own...WG had threw away what rudimentary tutorial they had at some point and replacing them with videos...which do not give any hand-on training on handling the plane. The low score prove to be not enough of deterrent for fighters to actively attack ground targets, and solution to persuading them otherwise is nowhere to be found. I don't think new players would know what flaps are or how they effect the plane...in fact, the manual flaps key is not binded by default, it feels like an outright omission. They have given up, as with pretty much everything else here.

 

Even the most powerful of planes still need player's input and poor tactical decision still lead to overall defeat (which means no x2, no salvage, no win condition medals, no progression for mission that ask for win). Aircraft performance doesn't mean jack when the pilot can't make the most out of it...or at least enough to outplay the opposition in the immediate area. But like I said before, there's literally nothing guiding the players to develop even the remotely correct (save for the vague guideline on loading screen) way to fly a given craft, and it keep on feeding in a cycle.

 

About accepting more wait time for more balanced matches, be careful what you wish for. They've already tried that, and it turned out to be the killing blow that necessitated the deployment of bots in normal matches to begin with. People were already leaving with the control fiasco prior to that but there were still a number who stayed. Having to wait many minutes (Personally I've waited for 34 minutes maximum, some claimed to have waited over an hour) was truly ridiculous and certain to kill interest and patience.

 

WoWS CV 'fix' to me feels like history repeating after how WoWP 2.0 was launched. Both had (heavily) negative reception among the initial group of testers, and they both made it to live anyway. Both are attempts at simplfication that ended up developing their own caveats over time and ended up being equally, if not more, complex than the past model they were supposed to replace. Interestingly enough, the rhetoric behind CV 'fix' is something of "multitasking is bad"...funny when you think that WoWP is pretty much fundamentally multitasking, but I digress.



WoWP makes a great jousting game...especially with the 262 and people busy in furballs...
I am deaf, silent, and fly with unrealistic controls. Do not count on me to carry - my back's already broken from overweight.

losttwo #7 Posted 03 September 2019 - 07:37 PM

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As for bug fixing.

Yes Wargaming really needs to work on cleaning up the entire program and algorithms.

While concentrating on fixing the bugs that destroy the play-ability of this game.

 

I do prefer the minimalist interface.

 

Balance:

     Vehicle, yes I think there is still some balancing issues and each patch tends to change balance on several aircraft.

    Match Maker. The only thing I would like to see is a separation between Experienced players and new players between tier 1,2,3

                          Otherwise the balance of matches is acceptable to me and I see no problem with it.

 

Wargaming has a tendency to promote low tier play by awarding NEW premium aircraft during special events.

       I think the last winnable aircraft was a tier 2 something or other.

       Take a person with 1000 hours of play time and give him a new tier 2 and he will dominate and decimate

       any new player. More so when he flights up with a pair of the new planes.

       YES player skill is very obvious in this game versus non skilled players.

 

I do not play low tiers much, but I do play them. My grind is mostly towards tokens and normally I do not go below tier 4.

I only own tier 2 and tier 3 premiums.

 

 

So I guess over all I lean towards disagreeing with about half of what you wrote.



Ace_BOTlistic_Cosmo #8 Posted 03 September 2019 - 07:43 PM

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View Postlosttwo, on 03 September 2019 - 02:37 PM, said:

As for bug fixing.

Yes Wargaming really needs to work on cleaning up the entire program and algorithms.

While concentrating on fixing the bugs that destroy the play-ability of this game.

 

I do prefer the minimalist interface.

 

Balance:

     Vehicle, yes I think there is still some balancing issues and each patch tends to change balance on several aircraft.

    Match Maker. The only thing I would like to see is a separation between Experienced players and new players between tier 1,2,3

                          Otherwise the balance of matches is acceptable to me and I see no problem with it.

 

Wargaming has a tendency to promote low tier play by awarding NEW premium aircraft during special events.

       I think the last winnable aircraft was a tier 2 something or other.

       Take a person with 1000 hours of play time and give him a new tier 2 and he will dominate and decimate

       any new player. More so when he flights up with a pair of the new planes.

       YES player skill is very obvious in this game versus non skilled players.

 

I do not play low tiers much, but I do play them. My grind is mostly towards tokens and normally I do not go below tier 4.

I only own tier 2 and tier 3 premiums.

 

 

So I guess over all I lean towards disagreeing with about half of what you wrote.

I disagree with the other half and about half of what you wrote...

but I'm not sure which half

I'll get back to you in a half

.

.

.

lately...

I've got a weak back

:unsure:

.

.

.

(I really didn't read any of it)


if the pilot's good, see, I mean, if he's really..sharp, he can barrel that baby in so low [he spreads his arms like wings and laughs],

you oughtta see it sometime, it's a sight. A big plane like a '52. VRROOM! There's jet exhaust, fryin' chickens in the barnyard.


losttwo #9 Posted 03 September 2019 - 08:42 PM

    which way do we go?

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I got some Ouzo for that back

qu33kKC #10 Posted 03 September 2019 - 10:52 PM

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death >>> ouzo.  :angry:

The_Wild_Weasel #11 Posted 03 September 2019 - 11:20 PM

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This game had a chance............ 

 

its time has come ...and gone.

 

same people ...new players stay for a while ....then leave.... 

 

 



Ace_BOTlistic_Cosmo #12 Posted 03 September 2019 - 11:42 PM

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View Postlosttwo, on 03 September 2019 - 03:42 PM, said:

I got some Ouzo for that back

sounds like the start to a fine late summer evening

 


Edited by Ace_BOTlistic_Cosmo, 03 September 2019 - 11:44 PM.

if the pilot's good, see, I mean, if he's really..sharp, he can barrel that baby in so low [he spreads his arms like wings and laughs],

you oughtta see it sometime, it's a sight. A big plane like a '52. VRROOM! There's jet exhaust, fryin' chickens in the barnyard.


Noreaga #13 Posted 04 September 2019 - 02:38 PM

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View Postlosttwo, on 03 September 2019 - 03:42 PM, said:

I got some Ouzo for that back

me+ouzo+plates+Korfu=donkey stall wake up and a missing toga walk of shame.

 

Oh good times, what was the thread about again? 


Nimis obnoxii curare


losttwo #14 Posted 04 September 2019 - 04:09 PM

    which way do we go?

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View PostNoreaga, on 04 September 2019 - 09:38 AM, said:

me+ouzo+plates+Korfu=donkey stall wake up and a missing toga walk of shame.

 

Oh good times, what was the thread about again? 


About praying to porcelain altars and not knowing how we got somewhere with out owning a vehicle

 



GonerNL #15 Posted 05 September 2019 - 07:31 AM

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Bugs are killing this game ... not an evening goes by without crashing or being disconnected at least 3 or 4 times.

Not even mentioning the in-game buglets and the matchmaking (one big bug).


Flying on NA and EU servers

trikke #16 Posted 05 September 2019 - 11:56 AM

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great post, OP


Well thought out and presented, but if the RU server folks are okay with the status quo... nothing will change


Spittoon says #smarterpilotswinmore

Deltavee #17 Posted 06 September 2019 - 06:40 PM

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View PostWhoaBlackBetty, on 03 September 2019 - 09:53 AM, said:

I like the ideas about how to get us vets out of the noob tiers, a lot.  I have to say though, there are not enough players down there to call it clubbing humans.  What you are clubbing are low tier bots and the game itself.  When we can get 5 to 10 humans every battle, then I will call it clubbing.

 

WBB

 

I agree.  When I wind up playing in a game with 15 bots (eg. NA around suppertime EST or EU after they're all in bed) I can't call it seal clubbing.  That happens a lot.

If there are humans to be found I usually restrict myself to playing with only cannons via weapon group separation.  If all I have is MGs, then I pursue bots only. 

Thank you Dr Sinister for the bot marking facility.


Deltavee

Sic Itur Ad Astra

Such is the pathway to the stars

Flying NA and EU


DeathLord1969 #18 Posted 07 September 2019 - 10:53 PM

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Since I came back as I was bored with wows, I noticed the UI is damn slow on my high end machine, higher than when I played prior to 2.0.

 






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