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The Problem with Warplanes is.....

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Prenzlau #1 Posted 01 April 2019 - 03:17 PM

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    The problem with Warplanes is....

 

    To start with, there are only two real possibilities when it comes to control and understanding of this game by it's creators. 

 

    First, they completely understand their own system and creation and therefore are able to manipulate the behavior of this game by using bots, AA, defense planes, maps, match maker, etc. They most likely do not target a specific person, but they are easily able to push certain buttons and pull certain cords (like the Wizard of OZ behind the curtain) to increase or decrease difficulties for certain plane types, or even skill levels of players by making it easier or more difficult.

 

    Second, they completely do not understand or have meaningful control over their own creation and thus patterns and anomalies happen which to any suspicious mind seems too intentional versus not, but in reality it is a system that is not measured or controlled properly and thus it plays "havok" with players and their psychology. There may also be an internal disconnect where only a smaller group understands "more" of their creation, but that group is either unwilling or unavailable to communicate with the rest of them. 

 

    Either way, whatever you chose to believe, as players you are being psychologically messed with. How it affects people, is totally different depending on the person and what they do to rationalize winning and losing. How things happen, and in what way. As proof, since I have been playing this game, I've noticed a strong reluctance with WG to really answer any specific questions beyond the simple stuff. The reason for this might either be one of two things. First the people that communicate with the player community have no way of knowing themselves or do not receive the proper responses or answers. Second, the truth and real answers are not allowed to be shared to this community and that is how they roll. 

 

    So in the end, whether this game is "doing something to you" on purpose or by complete randomness, you as a player have to take a step back and "harden" your emotions and expectations. You're not going to get any really meaningful answers from them, not the ones that really would make any difference. So some people are claiming they are not having fun? This game is more fun when you change your expectations and goals. The beginning of understanding is asking the first few questions and then following what path those questions create. 

 

    Cheers!

 

    Prenzlau


Edited by Prenzlau, 01 April 2019 - 03:37 PM.

 

 

 

 


Ace_BOTlistic_Cosmo #2 Posted 01 April 2019 - 03:43 PM

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if the pilot's good, see, I mean, if he's really..sharp, he can barrel that baby in so low [he spreads his arms like wings and laughs],

you oughtta see it sometime, it's a sight. A big plane like a '52. VRROOM! There's jet exhaust, fryin' chickens in the barnyard.


Prenzlau #3 Posted 01 April 2019 - 04:03 PM

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View PostAce_BOTlistic_Cosmo, on 01 April 2019 - 09:43 AM, said:

 

    People are naturally "suspicious", it is part of our internal defense, and entertainment, politics and advertising has spent the past 200+ breaking through that defense so people will believe "whatever". 

 

    My point is that suspicions don't matter as much (in the case of this game) because the cause will most likely never be revealed. We search for causation so we can create the ability to control, yet when we cannot find causation or what some people would call rational explanations, we realize we do not have the control we desire. Seeking control takes many forms and is often masked by other things, but it is always there and we all pursuit it in our lives and everything we do. 

 

    I realized a long time ago that before I would be able to understand and rationalize the "world at large", I would first have to understand "the world within". If a person was to write a daily journal as to what they think about during their days, it would be come clear as to how much time they spend on any inner contemplation. My guess generally speaking is that people spend very little actual time doing so and most of their thoughts are cluttered with fantasy and projections, with most of their consciousness focused on external events and situations. Keep in mind that when you watch television, a movie, play a video game, your mind is "entrained". 

 

    I like Elvis. Such an iconic figure. 

 

    Cheers!

 

    Prenzlau


 

 

 

 


jack_wdw #4 Posted 01 April 2019 - 04:09 PM

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... mainly alienating your loyal playerbase

Ace_BOTlistic_Cosmo #5 Posted 01 April 2019 - 04:11 PM

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View PostPrenzlau, on 01 April 2019 - 11:03 AM, said:

 

    People are naturally "suspicious", it is part of our internal defense, and entertainment, politics and advertising has spent the past 200+ breaking through that defense so people will believe "whatever". 

 

    My point is that suspicions don't matter as much (in the case of this game) because the cause will most likely never be revealed. We search for causation so we can create the ability to control, yet when we cannot find causation or what some people would call rational explanations, we realize we do not have the control we desire. Seeking control takes many forms and is often masked by other things, but it is always there and we all pursuit it in our lives and everything we do. 

 

    I realized a long time ago that before I would be able to understand and rationalize the "world at large", I would first have to understand "the world within". If a person was to write a daily journal as to what they think about during their days, it would be come clear as to how much time they spend on any inner contemplation. My guess generally speaking is that people spend very little actual time doing so and most of their thoughts are cluttered with fantasy and projections, with most of their consciousness focused on external events and situations. Keep in mind that when you watch television, a movie, play a video game, your mind is "entrained". 

 

    I like Elvis. Such an iconic figure. 

 

    Cheers!

 

    Prenzlau

I got your point the first post and agree

If you've ever studied statistics

and truly understand mathematical probability

and are insightful enough to include all pertinent variables...

you'll hopefully understand a situation,

but by not including a single (what seems to be) non important variable... /

results are skewed...

oh well

:unsure:


if the pilot's good, see, I mean, if he's really..sharp, he can barrel that baby in so low [he spreads his arms like wings and laughs],

you oughtta see it sometime, it's a sight. A big plane like a '52. VRROOM! There's jet exhaust, fryin' chickens in the barnyard.


Snprhed #6 Posted 01 April 2019 - 04:14 PM

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Well Im about done with this game. Whether its through willful manipulation, or incompetence, it doesnt much matter to me. Today I was defending a sector that "we" owned as I figured out where I was going next my plane took a bunch of damage and caught on fire. Nobody in red around. Im sure some will say oh its probably just lag.... whatever it happens all the time. I also had one that we owned that flipped as soon as a red flew into it. It wasnt even really that close maybe 50% and I had just killed a red in the zone....

 

The way they set these up they (WOWP) have their thumbs on the scales way too much.

 

How many times have you been in a close match with 1 other human and even though your 2 scores are close they get air superiority? Or how many times have you lost the match when you thoroughly outplayed the only other human in the match? I love the planes, but the way they do matches is stupid ridiculous.



Prenzlau #7 Posted 01 April 2019 - 04:39 PM

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    People just want a better game, one in which they can more clearly see why they either win or lose without things happening that have no easily observed rational explanation.

 

    I've been observing and studying this. Is the game just flawed and problematic because that is how it is, or is the game complicated by tweaks and changes to "tip the scales" and thus many more problems are manifested that players perceive but do not understand the cause. 

 

    If the spokes people for Warplanes came out and said, "that they do not meddle or manipulate their game for circumstance" would any one believe them? If they said everything was simply random, would that be believable? 

 

    Here is an example. When doing step by step missions to get planes, has anyone ever noticed that it takes longer than it should to complete certain requirements? When you need to shoot down a certain type of plane, few are in the match maker on the other team. When you need a specific award it gets noticeably more difficult for whatever reason.

 

    I will be the first to admit that when you concentrate on a specific need it might very well become more psychologically difficult. However, I've noticed that the game seems to deprive the resources and circumstance to easily complete or achieve. So my ultimate question is whether there is any automatic manipulation going on that is written in. You see if they can make a heavy fighter be able to calculate the amount of damage it is receiving from a bombers turret gun and veer away just in time to avoid dying, they can also have automatic triggers for these chain step missions. "Oh that player needs to shoot down 10 enemy fighters in a single battle and win", well lets limit the number of fighters (on the other team) and make it more difficult to win. They would not do that, would they?

 

    People want a more honest and rational game. 

 

Cheers!

 

Prenzlau


Edited by Prenzlau, 01 April 2019 - 04:41 PM.

 

 

 

 


Perco_lator #8 Posted 01 April 2019 - 05:12 PM

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View PostPrenzlau, on 01 April 2019 - 11:17 AM, said:

   First the people that communicate with the player community have no way of knowing themselves or do not receive the proper responses or answers. Second, the truth and real answers are not allowed to be shared to this community and that is how they roll. 

  

 

I believe it's a combination of both plus add in poor management where subpar workmanship & the release of a substandard product is acceptable.

 

View PostPrenzlau, on 01 April 2019 - 11:17 AM, said:

     So some people are claiming they are not having fun? This game is more fun when you change your expectations and goals.

 

Not so cut & dry for people that have experienced better times & enjoyed this title at it's peak. The same people that stuck around during it's decline & failed updates/changes but still found a little fun in it.

There comes a point where you've lowered your expectations so much that you need to start checking yourself for a pulse.


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Prenzlau #9 Posted 01 April 2019 - 05:38 PM

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View PostPerco_lator, on 01 April 2019 - 11:12 AM, said:

 

 

 

    If you are capable of such rational thought and it appears we agree on some fundamental opinions about this game.

 

    Why then have you been agitating me for the past 18 months?

 

    Prenzlau


Edited by Prenzlau, 01 April 2019 - 05:39 PM.

 

 

 

 


legoboy0401 #10 Posted 01 April 2019 - 05:41 PM

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View PostPerco_lator, on 01 April 2019 - 09:12 AM, said:

 

I believe it's a combination of both plus add in poor management where subpar workmanship & the release of a substandard product is acceptable.

 

 

Not so cut & dry for people that have experienced better times & enjoyed this title at it's peak. The same people that stuck around during it's decline & failed updates/changes but still found a little fun in it.

There comes a point where you've lowered your expectations so much that you need to start checking yourself for a pulse.

 

I never thought I would say this in response to one of your posts, but:

 

I agree.


Edited by legoboy0401, 01 April 2019 - 05:42 PM.

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CorvusCorvax #11 Posted 01 April 2019 - 05:51 PM

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View PostPrenzlau, on 01 April 2019 - 04:39 PM, said:

 

    People want a more honest and rational game. 

Maybe.  I don't think the deck is stacked against me, except when it comes to Expert bots.  They know exactly what control and weapon input you make, when you make it, and can counter those in real time.  A human, you can fool into doing what you want them to.  I can tease a Yak-30 driver to come up and see me where I do best.   A bot?  Rarely.  If I get outside their performance envelope, they break off and make me chase.  A bot chasing a bomber will almost always break contact before destruction, heal up, then come back.  These algorithms are not created to cheat or to impede individuals.  I have noticed that ADAs will also act in a manner that would imply very close coordination in the real world.  But they act this way always, and can be spoofed.  Ground fire knows where you will be and when.  Pretending othewise is stupid.

 

I have enjoyed this game since the early days.  And for different reasons in each iteration.  I will still enjoy it until they pack up shop. 

 

Having said that, I enjoy the game purely from the 4-dimensional thought required.  All three axes of flight, plus the strategic dimension offered by the PvE part of the game.  It requires not only tactical prowess, but map and goals thinking.  I would like more end-game content, but hey, one can dream, yes?



wylleEcoyote #12 Posted 01 April 2019 - 06:00 PM

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View PostCorvusCorvax, on 01 April 2019 - 12:51 PM, said:

I have enjoyed this game since the early days.  And for different reasons in each iteration.  I will still enjoy it until they pack up shop. 

 

 

I am a sadomasochist.:trollface: So WG products; for all the good and bad, are perfect for me. :P

YMMV

Edited by wylleEcoyote, 01 April 2019 - 06:01 PM.

        


wylleEcoyote #13 Posted 01 April 2019 - 06:02 PM

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View PostPrenzlau, on 01 April 2019 - 12:38 PM, said:

 

    If you are capable of such rational thought and it appears we agree on some fundamental opinions about this game.

 

    Why then have you been agitating me for the past 18 months?

 

    Prenzlau

 

Because its April Fool's? Why ask why?

        


White_Widow18 #14 Posted 01 April 2019 - 06:06 PM

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Every wall I hit in this game I find a way around said wall, just had to get creative and stop expecting to be able to keep doing non-stop just the same thing over and over.

Do I feel these last events were.. poorly managed and designed? Yes. They needed some definite work and a better intro explanation to the functions and tactics of the match modes.

Insofar as "bugs in the game" and "crashing all the time".

I only have crash bugs if I alt-tab out or there is a network issue. I also only seem to have the weird visual artifacts when that happens. The only other thing that consistently triggers a bug issue is flight chat in game.. I've also turned off QoS packet scheduling and every other single thing meant to shape the flow of my network traffic and suddenly I'm getting 30 and 40 matches in a row without a crash unless I alt-tab out during load screens and I think that's a focus theft issue in the way windows functions vs. the way the game works and needs to work. I've also completely nuked every non-essential background process so that -nothing- can steal focus or network resources.  I also survive on a 10mbps DSL line and have a potato of a laptop, so I sincerely am confused how I can get a less buggy game than others by just stripping the unnecessary junk out and making the connection that Windows allocates primo resources to whatever application has focus at a given point and that alt-tabbing out during load screens has killed literally ever MMO game I've ever played -including- World of WarCraft for the -very- longest time.

I think there are two primary things wrong with this game though.

Neither of them IMHO are anything to do with WG though.

#1 - People come into this game with some sort of expectation to be a 'hero' and then get their faces handed to them repeatedly and get angry and talk about "balance issues" and rant and rant and rant about these things, stirring the drama up as fiercely as they can and that draws in every possible fringe accusation no matter how ludicruous for people to consider as reasonable accusations. The game isn't designed -for you specifically-. It's a game with a playing field and base rules and variables. It's literally like walking up to a poker table and expecting to be dealt good hands so you can compete.

#2 - People think the Forums are -at all- representative of the playerbase. The community here on the forums is a microscopic speck in the playerbase. Not even. No matter how much anyone rants and raves in here.. all you are is a vocal minority. That's it. People constantly look for validation and backup and they even frequently get it here in the forum from the other forum dwellers. Echo chambers work like that.

Sorry... I can actually explain the situation in one issue from my view.

Ego.

People want the game to be about them them them and they don't understand that a game that's not designed by a bunch of western individualists is unlikely to make you the hero by design. You want to be a hero? Make yourself one within the rules and limits of the game and stop going but _I_ wanna. It's a literal cultural difference at a base level as far as I can tell there.

*shrug*

YMMV, but the #1 reason this game has bad moments for me is when I forget that this game isn't here to stroke my ego and make me feel special and important.

This isn't targeted at anyone in particular incidentally, just food for thought.
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SkyWolf__WM #15 Posted 01 April 2019 - 06:09 PM

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View PostPrenzlau, on 01 April 2019 - 10:17 AM, said:

    The problem with Warplanes is....(Snipped for brevity)

 So in the end, whether this game is "doing something to you" on purpose or by complete randomness, you as a player have to take a step back and "harden" your emotions and expectations. You're not going to get any really meaningful answers from them, not the ones that really would make any difference. So some people are claiming they are not having fun? This game is more fun when you change your expectations and goals. The beginning of understanding is asking the first few questions and then following what path those questions create. 

 

    Cheers!

 

    Prenzlau

 

One of my greatest Achievements is being THE ONLY student at Stetson University to alter his appearance and appear the before the business school's dean TWICE to drop Statistics!  I am just too cool. :trollface:


Edited by SkyWolf__WM, 01 April 2019 - 06:10 PM.

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Perco_lator #16 Posted 01 April 2019 - 06:10 PM

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View PostPrenzlau, on 01 April 2019 - 01:38 PM, said:

 

    If you are capable of such rational thought and it appears we agree on some fundamental opinions about this game.

 

    Why then have you been agitating me for the past 18 months?

 

    Prenzlau

 

Well 18 months ago you were busy spilling kool-aid all over the place, agitation is required to get the stains out.

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SkyWolf__WM #17 Posted 01 April 2019 - 06:14 PM

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View PostPerco_lator, on 01 April 2019 - 01:10 PM, said:

 

Well 18 months ago you were busy spilling kool-aid all over the place, agitation is required to get the stains out.

 

The kool aid Reference is .....uh ...a....well, It's played out. :facepalm:
***************Fail to Suck****************

I shall use my aircraft and my skill to slightly inconvenience mine enemies.


Prenzlau #18 Posted 01 April 2019 - 06:18 PM

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View PostPerco_lator, on 01 April 2019 - 12:10 PM, said:

 

Well 18 months ago you were busy spilling kool-aid all over the place, agitation is required to get the stains out.

 

    The human mind is like gears to a vehicle. Just because a person is comfortable in low gear doesn't mean they are not capable of so much more. It might have always seemed self righteous on my part, and yes with some arrogant flavor, but all I have ever wanted was to inspire people (or get them to move out of their comfort zone). Not to be chased out of town for the attempt.

 

Prenzlau

 

 


 

 

 

 


CorvusCorvax #19 Posted 01 April 2019 - 06:46 PM

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View PostPrenzlau, on 01 April 2019 - 06:18 PM, said:

 

 Not to be chased out of town for the attempt.

 

 

Never underestimate the inferiority complex in others, and how they will fight to not have their shortcomings exposed.

 

Treating Bad_Coffee as an intellectual equal or as a straight actor in this forum game will almost certainly cause you (or anyone else) grief.  Dismissive disdain is the way to deal with forum trolls.  If he was interested in anything but the forum game, he would actually play, so there is your proof of the claim I am making.



FlakValleyExpress #20 Posted 01 April 2019 - 07:00 PM

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View PostPrenzlau, on 01 April 2019 - 10:17 AM, said:

    The problem with Warplanes is....

 

    To start with, there are only two real possibilities when it comes to control and understanding of this game by it's creators

 

    Cheers!

 

    Prenzlau

 

I'll stop you right there. OP I am letting you know the original WoWP creators are no longer with WG. What we have here are WoWP caretakers pushing an agenda of bad. If this was nursing a home, a lawyer would have been involved by now. The original WoWP creators are working on mobile phone apps BTW. OP your points have been noticed by other WoWP pilots from the other regions.

 


Edited by FlakValleyExpress, 01 April 2019 - 07:01 PM.

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