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Am I "Wrong" to keep flying with the joystick bug?


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White_Widow18 #21 Posted 29 January 2019 - 12:50 AM

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And I think my last "simple" joystick setup was an old MS Sidewinder.. I actually still have it somewhere but I doubt there's any working drivers anywhere for it.

Azis_ #22 Posted 29 January 2019 - 12:58 AM

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Cool WW, that was actually my first joy the MS sidewinder...simple beast it was. Used it in Xwing vs Tiefighter. Our founder and tech of RBL still has one that works so, I bet there are simple drivers (dudn't need much) that could make it work.

Edited by Azis_, 29 January 2019 - 12:59 AM.

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egikov #23 Posted 29 January 2019 - 01:18 AM

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I don't remember the name of my first joystick, it had two buttons.

Next one was Cyborg 3d Gold, I really liked it, very easy to move, very convenient buttons and throttle lever. But it broke after many years - the trigger (it's very thin). It was adjustable for any hand, big or small, left or right.

Currently I use Logitech extreme 3d pro, it's harder to move, it has too many buttons at wrong places; but it's reliable and probably less expensive.


Edited by egikov, 29 January 2019 - 01:20 AM.


White_Widow18 #24 Posted 29 January 2019 - 01:23 AM

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My last simple setup was -specifically- the MS SideWinder Pro with Force Feedback. Mechanically it was probably the best joystick ever made. No pontentiometers to wear out in it and the adjustable spring tension was phenomenal. If I find it I might try to find drivers, buuuutttt....

If someone can point me in the direction of something with a comparable hardware spec I -might- consider springing for one with taxes because I'm a masochist about bugs and I -do- miss a joystick even though I've gotten good at the keyboard setup.

Azis_ #25 Posted 29 January 2019 - 01:49 AM

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I gave up on Saeitech, CH and any other I tried, Logitech seems to be about the last one left and for 30 bux bout the best bargain IMO. Ergonomic and solid base. I have actually worn my hand print into the knurling on the handle from gripping it but it has hung in there.

I have had them apart also and some things can be repaired. Most places offer an additional replacement warranty....used to be worth it when I played more but as I mentioned, this one has held me 5 yrs or so and I have a new one int the box still.


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trikke #26 Posted 29 January 2019 - 02:24 AM

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View Postbradk62, on 28 January 2019 - 05:23 PM, said:

Interesting.  You're the second person I  know of to make the transition BACK to mouse/kb.  The other did so because of the cost of replacing joysticks.  Is this your reason as well or do you really like playing on the mouse better?

 

Was hoping the discussion would go along the lines of "should I fly with this bug knowing I might be a detriment to my team" but good discussion.

 

nope... both still work, probably     i just loved the hotas, and if i ever make good on my promise to only fly bombers, i will dig it out

 

i can fly well enough with a mouse, but i'm a much better pinpoint aimer with a mouse

 

i struggled trying to hold my whole arm still enough to be able to aim without any jitter while using a js  

 

crap, it's hard enough for me to hold the mouse still enough when the adrenaline is really flowing 

 

 


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Deltavee #27 Posted 29 January 2019 - 03:25 AM

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View PostWhite_Widow18, on 28 January 2019 - 07:11 PM, said:

It's taken a lot of time to get a keybind setup I can roll between with my own arthritis and I'm constantly wishing honestly I just had an addon ten-key that I could keybind it all to because it has better spacing/layout than WASD does.. but my simple little laptop's ten key is painfully positioned so C'est La Vie.

 

I can honestly recommend a Logitech G13 mini keyboard.  All the keys are aligned one above the other, unlike regular offset keyboard keys.  It has 23 programmable keys as well as a programmable mini-joystick with two additional programmables beside it, for left thumb use.  You can preset up to four different games into it accessed with a few keypresses just below a multi-function backlit screen.  The whole thing is in a body that is arched so that it provides wrist support and your fingers naturally fall to the keys without strain.  And it has about a five or six foot long cord so placing it comfortably is no problem.  I used it extensively before I got my stick and was quite happy with it. 

Remembering what key binds you use for what game can be a bit of a challenge until you get used to it, but it is easy to "transfer" entire blocks of the keyboard functions and overlay them on the G13s keypad so it plays pretty much the same as your keyboard key locations without breaking your wrist to hit laptop keys.

Between the G13 and my G602 mouse I had over 30 programmable keys at hand.  Not having to touch the keyboard at all is very nice as well as comfortable.

As well as single keypresses you can program any of the keys to run macros with a single keypress and the rollover number of keys is referred to as N, so it means you won't get unintended keypresses no matter how fast you are.  It ain't cheap (over $100 if memory serves) but it's definitely worth it.  Hit their site to look at it.

No, I don't have any affiliation with Logitech but some of their stuff is pretty darned good.


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Captain_Rownd #28 Posted 29 January 2019 - 03:29 AM

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View Posttrikke, on 29 January 2019 - 02:24 AM, said:

 

 

i struggled trying to hold my whole arm still enough to be able to aim without any jitter while using a js  

 

Aim with joystick is pretty poor.  It doesn't have fine resolution, so I certainly have a much lower hit rate with it.  (I try to use yaw a lot in aiming because my throttle thumbstick seems to have much better resolution than the joystick pitch/roll)  However, manouvering ("flying") with the joystick is great, which my primary concern. 

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bradk62 #29 Posted 29 January 2019 - 04:44 AM

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View Posttrikke, on 29 January 2019 - 02:24 AM, said:

 

i can fly well enough with a mouse, but i'm a much better pinpoint aimer with a mouse

 

i struggled trying to hold my whole arm still enough to be able to aim without any jitter while using a js  

 

crap, it's hard enough for me to hold the mouse still enough when the adrenaline is really flowing 

 

 

 

Flying is sooooo much easier with the Joystick.  Loops, rolls all effortless and I never have to pick up the mouse.  When I'm in a turning battle, I can see my mouse-flying opponents pause to re-position their mouse, and I gain on them every time they do.  

 

But it took me FOREVER to get the hang of shooting with the joystick.  I would always overshoot the target, over-correct and overshoot the other way.  Just took months and months of playing.  Now I lock on and fire - no fuss, no worries, deadly accurate.

 

After all the months I spent making the transition, I don't ever want to go back to the mouse.



bradk62 #30 Posted 29 January 2019 - 04:58 AM

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View PostDeltavee, on 29 January 2019 - 03:25 AM, said:

 

I can honestly recommend a Logitech G13 mini keyboard.  All the keys are aligned one above the other, unlike regular offset keyboard keys.  It has 23 programmable keys as well as a programmable mini-joystick with two additional programmables beside it, for left thumb use.  You can preset up to four different games into it accessed with a few keypresses just below a multi-function backlit screen.  The whole thing is in a body that is arched so that it provides wrist support and your fingers naturally fall to the keys without strain.  And it has about a five or six foot long cord so placing it comfortably is no problem.  I used it extensively before I got my stick and was quite happy with it. 

Remembering what key binds you use for what game can be a bit of a challenge until you get used to it, but it is easy to "transfer" entire blocks of the keyboard functions and overlay them on the G13s keypad so it plays pretty much the same as your keyboard key locations without breaking your wrist to hit laptop keys.

Between the G13 and my G602 mouse I had over 30 programmable keys at hand.  Not having to touch the keyboard at all is very nice as well as comfortable.

As well as single keypresses you can program any of the keys to run macros with a single keypress and the rollover number of keys is referred to as N, so it means you won't get unintended keypresses no matter how fast you are.  It ain't cheap (over $100 if memory serves) but it's definitely worth it.  Hit their site to look at it.

No, I don't have any affiliation with Logitech but some of their stuff is pretty darned good.

 

Thanks for the keyboard recommendation Deltavee!  I have actually been researching a programmable gamepad for just these reasons.

 

Just want  3 rows of 4 keys for my left hand, maybe times two if I can hit the shift key with my thumb.

 

 Programmable backlit colors for command types (communication=yellow, ordinance=red, target lock=blue, etc) would be nice but that gets real expensive fast.

 



White_Widow18 #31 Posted 29 January 2019 - 05:22 AM

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View PostDeltavee, on 28 January 2019 - 09:25 PM, said:

 

I can honestly recommend a Logitech G13 mini keyboard.  All the keys are aligned one above the other, unlike regular offset keyboard keys.  It has 23 programmable keys as well as a programmable mini-joystick with two additional programmables beside it, for left thumb use.  You can preset up to four different games into it accessed with a few keypresses just below a multi-function backlit screen.  The whole thing is in a body that is arched so that it provides wrist support and your fingers naturally fall to the keys without strain.  And it has about a five or six foot long cord so placing it comfortably is no problem.  I used it extensively before I got my stick and was quite happy with it. 

Remembering what key binds you use for what game can be a bit of a challenge until you get used to it, but it is easy to "transfer" entire blocks of the keyboard functions and overlay them on the G13s keypad so it plays pretty much the same as your keyboard key locations without breaking your wrist to hit laptop keys.

Between the G13 and my G602 mouse I had over 30 programmable keys at hand.  Not having to touch the keyboard at all is very nice as well as comfortable.

As well as single keypresses you can program any of the keys to run macros with a single keypress and the rollover number of keys is referred to as N, so it means you won't get unintended keypresses no matter how fast you are.  It ain't cheap (over $100 if memory serves) but it's definitely worth it.  Hit their site to look at it.

No, I don't have any affiliation with Logitech but some of their stuff is pretty darned good.

 

Hmmm *ponders* I like that from the sound of it, definitely going to give it a look because that offset is so... it's painful on this little keyboard I've got built into the laptop and something small but better key positions would be idea.

Edited by White_Widow18, 29 January 2019 - 05:22 AM.


Deltavee #32 Posted 29 January 2019 - 07:27 AM

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View Postbradk62, on 28 January 2019 - 11:58 PM, said:

 

Thanks for the keyboard recommendation Deltavee!  I have actually been researching a programmable gamepad for just these reasons.

 

Just want  3 rows of 4 keys for my left hand, maybe times two if I can hit the shift key with my thumb.

 

 Programmable backlit colors for command types (communication=yellow, ordinance=red, target lock=blue, etc) would be nice but that gets real expensive fast.

 

 

Yeah, the two keys that semi-surround the mini stick are right under your left thumb.  I had one programmed for shift (bombs) and the other for nearest target.  It gets automatic fast.

I forgot to mention that all the key binding is done by drag and drop after you download Logitech's software.  Real fast and easy to set up.


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