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Hording points and not playing the game


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Throffy #1 Posted 24 January 2019 - 06:37 AM

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Hi Guys,

 

Just wanted to throw out a game suggestion here.  In many battles I play in, I often see fellow teammates hovering over a captured sector, killing every plane that enters (under the protection of bots); and not actively working to win the game.

This puts a greater workload on the players who are moving from sector to sector, and also impacts their overall score because of the downtime when they are traveling to those sectors.

 

This is due in part to the nerfing of the credits that is so vital to progress in this game, and also the high cost of repairs if you are shot down ... these needs to be addressed promptly.  But there is still the fact that traveling to sectors is "credit downtime" in the game, and those who actively move around the map to win the games need to be rewarded for their efforts more.

 

MY SOLUTION.

1) Roll back (at least partially) the credits to pre-nerf so that people aren't so disparate for them.

2) Make being part of a sector capture FAR more credit valuable then just the amount of planes you shoot down.

3) Make it so capturing sectors lowers the cost of repairs at the end of the game - the more you capture the less it costs, therefore increasing your credits per game.

 

Please let me know what you think guys, and add more ideas if you have them.

 

Cheers and clear skies :honoring:

Throffy



sandtiger #2 Posted 24 January 2019 - 06:41 AM

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they could be just chase there daily's ..  Or  all the mission for the vamp and xp55... that are still going on

there are a lot of them that say need 8 kill while defending or more in some cases ..  so they could be just

token hunting  and or try to finish what ever mission or thing they are work on

and camping a base me help them do that

 

as a ga player i like it when i see team mate defending a key target ... no i not talk about the air base

i for one hardly ever get to use the repair i always to busy try to take base ... but if they keep the military base , mining plant and the command centers and some air base  like the one that well let a ga   spawn right next to a key base like  mining plant ...i am all good with that because if the keep the red team out i do not have to take that base again and again 

it makes my work load less

 but this is my opinion

 

but i would say the only way to get people to move to the next base is to stop have mission where you have to defend the base  to get the daily done  till that happens there will always be token hunters every one like more hangers  and  new planes so they will play what ever way they want to get the daily's done .. and that may be just sit over a base defending it sadly but i sure many people do this a lot  because there work on a mission or a daily

 

anyway like your topic good post

 but maybe a change to the daily missions would help

 

..

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


Edited by sandtiger, 24 January 2019 - 07:30 AM.


Throffy #3 Posted 24 January 2019 - 08:57 AM

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Thanks for the input Sandtiger :honoring:

 

I just want to add another point to this suggestion.

 

4) The further away the sector is from your spawn point, the greater the value for capturing it.



Captain_Rownd #4 Posted 24 January 2019 - 09:00 AM

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A lot of people are just trying to shoot as much red stuff as they can, and the cap game is not so clear to them.  When you've won a cap it's hard to leave it when 2-3 enemies are consistently moving in to take it from you, and instead of downing them you get to spend a minute or two flying to another cap where you'll probably just be outnumbered and get shot down fairly quick while you lose the one you just left because the enemy bomber/GA went there as you were dying elsewhere.  ;) 

J311yfish #5 Posted 24 January 2019 - 09:53 AM

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View PostThroffy, on 24 January 2019 - 01:37 AM, said:

In many battles I play in, I often see fellow teammates hovering over a captured sector, killing every plane that enters (under the protection of bots); and not actively working to win the game.

This puts a greater workload on the players who are moving from sector to sector, and also impacts their overall score because of the downtime when they are traveling to those sectors.

 

The above highlighted claims are not consistent with one another -- they cannot both be true at the same time.

 

If your teammate is staying in one spot killing anything that enters his area (which, by the way, could also be for a mission that he is trying to complete, even towards specialization), then that still helps you because it is less opposition that you are facing as you 'venture forth' to new areas.

 

It sounds like you need to get better at flying your airplane so you can quickly kill Air Defense Aircraft, and better at having an overall strategy (when to venture forth, and where, and why).

 

Your teammate wants to win too.  They don't want their high-scoring game to become a loss.  Maybe you can find a way to work with him/her to do it.

 


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qu33kKC #6 Posted 24 January 2019 - 12:54 PM

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View PostCaptain_Rownd, on 24 January 2019 - 09:00 AM, said:

When you've won a cap it's hard to leave it when 2-3 enemies are consistently moving in to take it from you, and instead of downing them you get to spend a minute or two flying to another cap where you'll probably just be outnumbered and get shot down fairly quick while you lose the one you just left because the enemy bomber/GA went there as you were dying elsewhere.  ;) 

 

This.  I've had MANY games where I was facing a steady stream of bots respawning and coming in.  I know that I need to do something to take another base, but am sort of stuck where I am defending.  It's a frustrating situation when your team is behind on points.  On the other hand, I've had some EPIC results in that situation.  Just part of the game.

Leadlooser #7 Posted 24 January 2019 - 01:29 PM

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Hmm,...

I think "4) The further away the sector is from your spawn point, the greater the value for capturing it," won't work unless the ground objectives are equidistant from the opposing teams' spawns, and then would captured forward airstrip/airbases cause nearer objectives' capture values to decrease?

 

I very much agree with J311yfish in that there are likely only a rare few that aren't trying to contribute to team wins whether they are capturing or defending.

 

Sandtiger also mentioned that there are daily missions and various grinds that require players to be selfish and counter productive to team play.  I believe this to be true as well.

 

I would also like to add that various planes have equally various attributes; some are fast and heavily armed for attack, whilst others are slower and better for area denial.  I do understand that when in a slow plane, other perhaps more attack appropriate planes are seemingly mucking about in objective-capture-less zones can be a mind-blowing headache, and oppositely when in a fast plane, seeing all one's capture points erased at a higher rate than one can capture them can cause the same symptom. - Simply, each plane, setup, pilot skills, and specializations specialize it for a particular role.

 

To further this idea, play like you like (you are indeed personally specialized as a human, too) and expect others to play like they like (they are 'special' as well).  If we're not playing, we're working and that's a real buzz-kill.

 

Nonetheless, thank you for your ideas and keep posting them.  We all improve when we take the time to commiserate.



CorvusCorvax #8 Posted 24 January 2019 - 01:58 PM

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View PostThroffy, on 24 January 2019 - 06:37 AM, said:

 

 

Just wanted to throw out a game suggestion here.  In many battles I play in, I often see fellow teammates hovering over a captured sector, killing every plane that enters (under the protection of bots); and not actively working to win the game.

 

 

 

I do this all the time.  Especially for a command center, mining plant, military base and airbase (in that order.)  The first two spawn sector-capturing events, and having them increases your chance to take other sectors without ever going there.  The mining plant is a GAA-magnet, and you can literally remove the ground attack threat from the game as bot GAA stream in one at a time to try and retake it.  The airbase is a general bot and human magnet that causes bots and people to stream in to get shot down in turn.  One of my biggest battles was me camped at an airbase shooting down a steady stream of bots and humans that should have been doing something other than turning the airfield clock back to blue, one aircraft at a time.

 

Holding a key sector is just as important as taking it in the first place.



trikke #9 Posted 24 January 2019 - 02:21 PM

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the best time to camp is when your team owns more caps than the other team

 

that's pretty simplified advice... and i'll admit that i don't always follow my own advice


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ShoeButton #10 Posted 24 January 2019 - 04:39 PM

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I Live By The Mantra "Get Outta The Blue Ya Bleeping JackA$$..."

 

Kills in the Blue do Nothing to advance the Team's chance at Victory, Pre Squall Line!

Kills in Neutral Sectors and Red Sectors push the Team Towards Victory!

Kills in No-Man's Land do Nothing to advance Team Victory, Pre Squall Line!

 

The Caveats:

Defensive Kill Missions. XF-55, Vampire and Dailies.

Steady Stream of Fighters, MR's and/or Heavies coming for your Head. It happens too often: Capture a Sector, line up on the next Base, then get jumped by Fighters before you can exit the Friendly Sector. Rince and Repeat...

Too often I've had the same Human Die, Respawn, Arrow straight Back to me and Die again three times or more in a row, Before I can get clear of a Friendly Sector. Only a Fool would turn their back on a Blood Thirsty Vengeance Crazed Human bent on killing you in Any Way Possible.

 

Sometimes getting outta the Blue Ain't Easy...

But it is still my Mantra to GTFO of the Blue, and GTFI the Red/Neutral..!

 

:hiding:

 

-ShoeButton


Edited by ShoeButton, 24 January 2019 - 04:42 PM.


Deltavee #11 Posted 24 January 2019 - 07:32 PM

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View PostCorvusCorvax, on 24 January 2019 - 08:58 AM, said:

 

I do this all the time.  Especially for a command center, mining plant, military base and airbase (in that order.)  The first two spawn sector-capturing events, and having them increases your chance to take other sectors without ever going there.  The mining plant is a GAA-magnet, and you can literally remove the ground attack threat from the game as bot GAA stream in one at a time to try and retake it.  The airbase is a general bot and human magnet that causes bots and people to stream in to get shot down in turn.  One of my biggest battles was me camped at an airbase shooting down a steady stream of bots and humans that should have been doing something other than turning the airfield clock back to blue, one aircraft at a time.

 

Holding a key sector is just as important as taking it in the first place.

 

I do the same thing, except for the airbases.  Most of the time it's flip a cap, labour on to the next one, look over your shoulder and the bluity cap is red again so when I play a map with an airfield and CC, Mine or Mil Base, I notify team in chat immediately that I'm going to cap and camp on one particular high value target and let the fighter jocks decimate each other over the airfields.  In an IL-2 there's not a lot of choice because of the low airspeed.  I often have 3 or 4 air kills in addition to target scores at the end of a battle.  All my GAs are fitted for agility and also, trolling with the turret can be amusing, actually. 

"Hoy, a GA flying in a straight line, Yes!"  Attacks.  Blam. 

The edumacation of tail gunners is not to be under-rated.

 

I don't consider this hoarding points, just adjusting to the reality of the game. As we say in pool, "You play what the table gives you."


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Booze_Morgan #12 Posted 24 January 2019 - 10:31 PM

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When my team is looking decently good, I see my bots killing, we have another cap or two, and the enemy is consistently sending in planes to take the sector I just capped, I will absolutely stay where I am as it is the best strategy for winning the battle. 

 

When we are not looking so good, yes I will leave that sector to cap. 

 

Punishing pilots who stay in a sector is categorically incorrect.  It takes away a proven strategy to do just what the OP wants to do, and that is, win the battle.



comtedumas #13 Posted 24 January 2019 - 11:44 PM

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Let me be the one to say it.  It’s “Hoarding” not “Hording”.  

hoom #14 Posted 25 January 2019 - 12:12 AM

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Its the big trade-off: hold what you have or seek out more points.

If your team just go cap to cap constantly attacking you're going to lose some to enemy coming to cap your points.

Sometimes you will cap quicker than the other team and win, other times the enemy team is quicker and you lose.

 

If you can defeat enemy planes coming to cap your point while the rest of your team goes & caps other points it can hugely contribute to winning.

But you can also get bogged down holding one point while the enemy goes and caps all the other points.

 

Block Quote

 Kills in the Blue do Nothing to advance the Team's chance at Victory, Pre Squall Line!

 Not always the case at all.

eg Missile base, airfield, missile base

If you hold one missile base & the airfield you win.

The enemy missile base is constantly throwing missiles at the airfield and will eventually flip it if left to itself.

The enemy team will also mostly try to cap the airfield so if you can keep beating enemy planes in the blue you can keep ahead of the missile base and win.

Or at least you can delay the flip -> gain more point advantage to your team so that when it flips back you're still ahead or only slightly behind.

 

Its true that a better way to win that setup (& what I do generally try to do) is to cap both missile bases which will then quickly flip the airfield and give you supremacy but thats generally harder to pull off than to hold the airfield, if you're not successful it will almost always give the enemy a long period of 2:1 & often enemy supremacy.

 

Another eg: mine, garrison, airfield, garrison

If you go kill the enemy GAs trying to cap the mine/defend your own so it becomes your point then keep defending that point by killing the GAs who keep coming to try to cap (& occasional fighter/heavy) then your team only needs to occasionally cap one of the other points to win & they will be severely handicapped in that because their GAs keep coming to the mine & getting killed while your own have free reign.


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Booze_Morgan #15 Posted 25 January 2019 - 12:18 AM

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View Posthoom, on 24 January 2019 - 06:12 PM, said:

Its the big trade-off: hold what you have or seek out more points.

If your team just go cap to cap constantly attacking you're going to lose some to enemy coming to cap your points.

Sometimes you will cap quicker than the other team and win, other times the enemy team is quicker and you lose.

 

If you can defeat enemy planes coming to cap your point while the rest of your team goes & caps other points it can hugely contribute to winning.

But you can also get bogged down holding one point while the enemy goes and caps all the other points.

 

 Not always the case at all.

eg Missile base, airfield, missile base

If you hold one missile base & the airfield you win.

The enemy missile base is constantly throwing missiles at the airfield and will eventually flip it if left to itself.

The enemy team will also mostly try to cap the airfield so if you can keep beating enemy planes in the blue you can keep ahead of the missile base and win.

Or at least you can delay the flip -> gain more point advantage to your team so that when it flips back you're still ahead or only slightly behind.

 

Its true that a better way to win that setup (& what I do generally try to do) is to cap both missile bases which will then quickly flip the airfield and give you supremacy but thats generally harder to pull off than to hold the airfield, if you're not successful it will almost always give the enemy a long period of 2:1 & often enemy supremacy.

 

Another eg: mine, garrison, airfield, garrison

If you go kill the enemy GAs trying to cap the mine/defend your own so it becomes your point then keep defending that point by killing the GAs who keep coming to try to cap (& occasional fighter/heavy) then your team only needs to occasionally cap one of the other points to win & they will be severely handicapped in that because their GAs keep coming to the mine & getting killed while your own have free reign.

 

​All this. ^

GonerNL #16 Posted 25 January 2019 - 01:24 PM

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View PostCorvusCorvax, on 24 January 2019 - 02:58 PM, said:

Holding a key sector is just as important as taking it in the first place.

 

That !

If a sector is bot honeypot I wil stay and kill 'm as it will keep 'm away from attacking/defending other sectors. And more than once I actually left one of those sectors only to see it flip not a minute later and the enemy getting air superiority ... and then it's over very quick.


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sandtiger #17 Posted 25 January 2019 - 11:52 PM

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one suggestion stop think the air base is the only way to win..  think out side of the box 

every game...  defend the base you have while take more ...

it is a hard balance  to keep but it is a must to win ...

and in some case it better just to keep the four base and not go after the 5th..

remember every base gives you 3 points every 5 second that you have it ..

the only one that is different is the plant because once you have it 

for two min it kick out 80 points if you have two that 160 point plus

the 3points  every 5 seconds  its  a game of math  if you think about it...

you can kill all the planes you want but at the end of the match

the team that had more base for the longest is the winner .

 

i used the plant in this example because

i find a lot of people in tier 8 and higher that do not  know  what the mining plant dose

but more often i find this in the  lower tiers because they just do not know ...

 

 

 

Squall line is the only time your kills count for anything more then your personal points ...

 

take base and keep them is how to win hands down

 

i forgot good topic    Throffy

 


Edited by sandtiger, 26 January 2019 - 12:04 AM.





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