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B-17D: Really weird flying characteristics


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legoboy0401 #1 Posted 21 January 2019 - 11:58 PM

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This plane, quite aside from it's less than adequate defenses, has a really hard time climbing. It starts stalling every 400 meters or so, so you have to bring the nose back down to horizontal and let it build up speed again before it can climb again. It does this WITH OR WITHOUT BOOST.

 

Yes, I understand it has a slow climb rate, but at the rate it wants to climb, it would take about 4 or 5 map lengths to get to a satisfactory altitude for this game without stopping.

 

Does it ever get any better? Even when the B-17D is at around 3,000 or so meters(where it's a little more safe from lower tier Heavy Fighters) it just seems to stall randomly.

 

Also, on certain maps, it refuses to climb higher than 2,700 meters. Period. End of story. True, I don't have the top engines, but I have the intermediate ones plus the engine equipment for increased cruise speed and engine thrust.

 

Is this a thing? Do the other two Heavy Bombers currently in the game behave like this? Or is it just this plane? Is there any way to rectify the odd flying characteristics and difficulty nursing it to a satisfactory altitude through a specific playstyle without exposing it to too many medium-altitude enemy and Air Defense planes?

 

Thanks in advance!


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Captain_Underpants53 #2 Posted 22 January 2019 - 01:12 AM

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Well, you NEED those engines and a 15 degree climb rate will get you there eventually.  A gunner with lots of skill points.........................er, never mind.  Won't help the B-17D very much.   :(    But the B-17G is a whole nother story as far as the gunner goes.   :)  You can afford to fly somewhat lower.
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Jazz_4 #3 Posted 22 January 2019 - 01:44 AM

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true the b17d is a meh plane basically I just flew mine to the points and dropped my bombs and get wrecked but with the b17g that bomber is a blast to play.

legoboy0401 #4 Posted 22 January 2019 - 03:10 AM

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View PostJazz_4, on 21 January 2019 - 05:44 PM, said:

true the b17d is a meh plane basically I just flew mine to the points and dropped my bombs and get wrecked but with the b17g that bomber is a blast to play.

I don't know. I just capped a Mining Plant in one pass with the B17D last battle just in the nick of time. The enemy was around 75 to 100 points ahead, and was close to getting enough points to win the battle. We were on 4(two Garrisons, one Airfield, and one Mining Plant  caps and they on a single Mining Plant But in came me, sweeping in to their Mining Plant, and used both sticks, one after the other, to nab 1 Medium Armored Ground Target, then two, then the Special Ground Target(the industrial one, I don't remember what they call it) and finally a third Medium Armored Ground Target and wham! the Mining Plant was ours and we got Superiority and we won.


An average player with an average goal: greatness, someday. Today, mediocrity will have to suffice. But no matter, I will always play to the best of my ability, and I will always strive to make the best of my ability just that little bit stronger and better.

 

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SpiritFoxMY #5 Posted 22 January 2019 - 05:15 AM

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The American Heavies shouldn't be flown in orbit - it wastes their potential and reduces their overall efficiency. A case could be made for the B-17D because its defenses are a lot weaker but for the 17G and 32 should be flown at optimum altitude for maximum speed between caps.

 

Personally I always fly at optimum for my bombers because I value speed more than the invulnerability. Pick Demolition Expert and Cruise Flight. Keep it at optimum and your finger on the boost. 


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Captain_Underpants53 #6 Posted 22 January 2019 - 05:45 AM

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:medal:
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Jazz_4 #7 Posted 22 January 2019 - 09:38 AM

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grats on your win I had the same thing happen to me in my b17g and b32 all those I think in the b32 match we lost but a few points it was a blast flipping caps while the other team tries to figure out what's going on. but as for myself ill stick with the b17g that bomber is a blast to play the b32 is alright but the a26b is also a blast to play.

qu33kKC #8 Posted 22 January 2019 - 11:16 PM

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what Captain Underwear sez above, and why.  The D needs a very shallow climb on boost to get to where it needs to be.  There is a screen view option to show climb angle, or just practice.  Getting to Spec in the D was a CHORE, but it is certainly better once Specialized.

trikke #9 Posted 23 January 2019 - 02:16 AM

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View PostSpiritFoxMY, on 22 January 2019 - 12:15 AM, said:

The American Heavies shouldn't be flown in orbit - it wastes their potential and reduces their overall efficiency. A case could be made for the B-17D because its defenses are a lot weaker but for the 17G and 32 should be flown at optimum altitude for maximum speed between caps.

 

Personally I always fly at optimum for my bombers because I value speed more than the invulnerability. Pick Demolition Expert and Cruise Flight. Keep it at optimum and your finger on the boost. 

 

such great advice...   i never had considered flying the G anywhere but the max alt, but i'm not moving around the map fast enough 

 

just looked it up  =  500kph at 2200m

 

i'll use my metric cheatsheet and we'll try it tonight!


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Jazz_4 #10 Posted 23 January 2019 - 08:41 AM

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I just [it engine guru on my bomber pilots so they can move around the map faster

hoom #11 Posted 26 January 2019 - 11:19 AM

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Got B-17D today.

3000m? Thats your problem there.

 

Me I've been cruising around 1900-2100m in the white to help keep speed up -> hit more with my sticks, seems to be working OK.

 

What isn't working well at all is the defensive fire arcs.

That horizontal no-fire band is almost always where the enemy flies & any turn puts an enemy who wasn't already, in there.

The side guns for some reason have most of their arc pointing forward over the wings (accidentally reversed?) so don't help with anything really.

 


Edited by hoom, 26 January 2019 - 11:20 AM.

C'est magnifique, mais ce n'est pas le SerB.

hoom #12 Posted 28 January 2019 - 06:03 AM

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Block Quote

 The side guns for some reason have most of their arc pointing forward over the wings

Worked out whats going on with this.

Its the left one facing forward, the right faces aft as I'd expected to see them.

 

So at first I was sure it must be a bug, but then I was looking round with the camera and it seems to be due to the position of the gunners, left gunner is standing aft with a slightly forward angle, right gunner is to the front with a rear angle.

 

Makes sense but annoying.


Edited by hoom, 28 January 2019 - 06:04 AM.

C'est magnifique, mais ce n'est pas le SerB.

HazeGrayUnderway #13 Posted 29 January 2019 - 09:34 PM

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View PostSpiritFoxMY, on 22 January 2019 - 05:15 AM, said:

The American Heavies shouldn't be flown in orbit - it wastes their potential and reduces their overall efficiency. A case could be made for the B-17D because its defenses are a lot weaker but for the 17G and 32 should be flown at optimum altitude for maximum speed between caps.

 

Personally I always fly at optimum for my bombers because I value speed more than the invulnerability. Pick Demolition Expert and Cruise Flight. Keep it at optimum and your finger on the boost. 

 

B17G's speed at optimal altitude compliments her reload of the upgraded 16x 500lb loadout.  The bombs should just about be reloaded by the time you arrive at the next cap.  The catch is you are also prime target for even multiroles that many of whom don't have a shot at you at higher altitudes.  But the extra speed to get around and nuke caps is a nice consideration.

 

It's kind of like when I do low bombing attacks with A26B.  It's a lot more dangerous than flying around at high altitude, but A26B flies so fast when hugging terrain that the tradeoff in risk is worthwhile.


Edited by HazeGrayUnderway, 29 January 2019 - 09:35 PM.


hoom #14 Posted 29 January 2019 - 09:44 PM

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There aren't that many Multiroles that hang out at 2100m though, occasionally one comes up but its fairly rare & they're going to be above their optimum.
C'est magnifique, mais ce n'est pas le SerB.

legoboy0401 #15 Posted 30 January 2019 - 01:25 AM

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Eh, the 190s have the speed to get up there easily and the boost to keep them up there should they start losing speed heavily in maneuvering to stay on the bomber's tail.

Edited by legoboy0401, 30 January 2019 - 01:25 AM.

An average player with an average goal: greatness, someday. Today, mediocrity will have to suffice. But no matter, I will always play to the best of my ability, and I will always strive to make the best of my ability just that little bit stronger and better.

 

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hoom #16 Posted 16 February 2019 - 08:15 AM

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Well I upgraded to the G now :)

So much better defensive fire, there are no blind-spots except high & low, there are a bunch of angles where 2 twin turrets fire on enemy simultaneously, some angles you get additional single guns too & guns not able to shoot at you current aim will shoot at other stuff that is in their angle which is cool.

The downside is there is no visual indicator of what angles you need to go to to get the extra guns, gotta work it out by visually counting tracer lines.

 

Its far from invulnerable though, had a battle where I got shot down 3 times in a row before I could even get into a cap to drop bombs :(

But I've had other battles where I've got 3+ aa kills too.

 

Free XPed the 2nd bomb stick, thats a serioius improvement to the damage output & definitely worthwhile.


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Captain_Underpants53 #17 Posted 16 February 2019 - 09:24 AM

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Also this bomber (all bombers really) definitely improves with Spec.  Shoot me wings?  You are in a bomber.  You already got the target on your back.
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legoboy0401 #18 Posted 16 February 2019 - 03:04 PM

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View Posthoom, on 16 February 2019 - 12:15 AM, said:

Well I upgraded to the G now :)

So much better defensive fire, there are no blind-spots except high & low, there are a bunch of angles where 2 twin turrets fire on enemy simultaneously, some angles you get additional single guns too & guns not able to shoot at you current aim will shoot at other stuff that is in their angle which is cool.

The downside is there is no visual indicator of what angles you need to go to to get the extra guns, gotta work it out by visually counting tracer lines.

 

Its far from invulnerable though, had a battle where I got shot down 3 times in a row before I could even get into a cap to drop bombs :(

But I've had other battles where I've got 3+ aa kills too.

 

Free XPed the 2nd bomb stick, thats a serioius improvement to the damage output & definitely worthwhile.

 

I'm only now just starting to learn a medium-altitude playstyle, as I've had to do so in my Do 217 M. The thing is RUBBISH at high level, at least without ordinance expert. It's a bit rough to play at medium-altitude(AA is at max effectiveness there), and I do get shot down a lot, but on the plus side this thing is FAST, and I mean FAST, both in speed and in capping at mid-altitude.

 

The stock grind is, well, it's a bugger to be sure. I was smart, though, and FXP'd the upgraded gondola gun first(based on my prior experience with the Ju-88a), to make the defenses at least tolerable. I have shot down one bot P-38J so far. I currently have not only the upgraded gondola gun, but also the first of the two top-turret upgrades(3 7.92s). Other than that, it's still stock. The grind for the second top turret upgrade(1 13 mm + 2 7.92 mm) is made more tolerable by the fact that I am using the Do 217 M gunner that I got from Skies of Albion so very, very long ago, with 3 skill points, so I immediately picked up Defensive Fire.


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#Failureisalwaysanoption

 

#Givingupneveris


hoom #19 Posted 16 February 2019 - 03:31 PM

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Yeah I've been using my 8pt A-26B crew in the B-17s so Quick Reflexes, Defensive Fire & Precision Gunner,

Still didn't help the D to do nearly any damage...


C'est magnifique, mais ce n'est pas le SerB.

hoom #20 Posted 23 February 2019 - 01:52 PM

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What are peoples' thoughts on running the G relatively low altitude, like 16-700m?

 

I feel like the gun firepower often goes to waste flying up 2200m, going lower could potentially reap a bunch of Light/Multirole/Defense fighter damage/kills while you pass through dropping bombs.

 

Problem is couple of times I've tried going under about 2000m I seem to get ganked hard so I'm disinclined to try it out more.


C'est magnifique, mais ce n'est pas le SerB.




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