Jump to content


Terminator Bots

Bomber Hunters Terminator Ill be back

  • Please log in to reply
78 replies to this topic

Prenzlau #1 Posted 12 December 2018 - 07:29 PM

    Command Chief Master Sergeant

  • Member
  • 8695 battles
  • 929
  • [OWSS] OWSS
  • Member since:
    12-14-2015

    I remember a few months ago (back in October) when I read through the Update 2.0.7 in the "General Balance Changes" section, that bot heavy fighters were no longer going to target bombers (relentlessly) like terminators.

 

Here it is.

 

  • Heavy Fighters’ priorities have been changed. Now they won't hunt bombers all battle long but will attack sectors: Military Base, Command Center, Airbase, and so on.

    I have been meaning to bring this to the attention of the forum for a while now. Heavy bot fighters still act as terminators, they lock on to bombers and relentlessly attack, and even after they are killed, they re-spawn and very often fly a direct line right back to the bomber they attacked before. Often the terminator heavy bot fighter will ignore enemy caps and ignore enemy planes while they fly straight for the bomber they have targeted. 

 

    I have watched heavies after being destroyed by my bomber re-spawn and fly straight to my bombers location, even if it is all the way across the map. Oh it is "Craig" the bot heavy fighter, good I destroyed him, (60 seconds later), oh it's "Craig" the heavy bot fighter again, ok I destroyed him, (another 60 seconds later), and while my bomber has a thread of health left, guess what? That's right, it's "Craig" the freaking heavy bot fighter again. This time Craig kicks my a**. 

 

    Also, I have watched bot heavies literally follow my bomber around the map for the whole battle, but because the particular bot heavy has trouble keeping altitude with my bomber, they bob around just below me, taking random pot shots. I've watched these bot heavies ignore other planes and caps because I have purposely flown over traffic and dog fights to see if they will break off, and most of the time they don't. I've also seen bot heavy fighters specifically come up from lower altitudes (while over a cap) to try and shoot at my bomber while there was other targets below of other plane types.

 

    Next, I and other players have seen what I would describe as bizarre and erratic heavy bot fighter behavior. I've seen bot heavies line up behind my bomber and start firing, but before I do any significant damage back with my tail or turret guns, the bot heavy fighter breaks off, circles around, comes back, fires just a few times and leaves, then a few minutes later the bot heavy fighter is back, repeats, and then mysteriously flies off with most of their health intact. Now I know this seems to contradict the whole terminator bot behavior, but let me make this clear, this does not happen very often at all, but when it does, it is very confusing for the bomber player since bots usually only veer off after they have had a lot of their health eliminated. A few times all the bot heavy had to do was shoot me since I was very low in hit points, and they would just mysteriously disengage. 

 

    I'm personally just bringing this forward because I was under the impression that bots were not supposed to behave like terminators, unless their name is "Craig". I'm capable of defending my bomber and dealing with the relentless challenge of the killer bots, but I have to really wonder how this affects other bomber players or do these heavies also target other plane types he same way??? I'm so used to it that I expect the onslaught of the heavy bot fighters in every match that I look at what kind of heavies the other team has and who is flying them, be it bots or humans because I know then how to approach the battle in altitude and what caps to attack first. 

 

    I know some people and players think flying bombers is easy and takes limited skill. Do you have any idea what it is like to have to defend your plane against one or two (sometimes more) enemy heavies and fighters while trying to bomb ground targets effectively??? These heavy fighters, whether they are human pilots or bots are killers! They out gun bombers 10 to 1 in firepower and are far more maneuverable as well. Many of them can go as high as bombers and are much faster! For a bomber to survive these attacks is amazing, and to actually shoot these planes down while using pea shooters compared to their cannons is also quite amazing. So please have some respect for the fact that the bomber has every disadvantage except maybe going to a high altitude at certain tiers. It is not as easy as some people think it is. 

 

****Oh by the way of you saw the post by my esteemed clan mate Arrrgh concerning the tail guns not working consistently, then using tail guns and turrets to defend against other planes is even more impressive. I guarantee if the guns on fighters did not work properly, and I know some will say they don't, but there would be an outcry over that for sure. 

 

Prenzlau


Edited by Prenzlau, 12 December 2018 - 07:52 PM.

 

 

 

 


Ace_BOTlistic_Cosmo #2 Posted 12 December 2018 - 07:48 PM

    Captain

  • Member
  • 858 battles
  • 4,033
  • [3NIC] 3NIC
  • Member since:
    01-26-2014

 

View PostPrenzlau, on 12 December 2018 - 02:29 PM, said:

    I remember a few months ago (back in October) when I read through the Update 2.0.7 in the "General Balance Changes" section, that bot heavy fighters were no longer going to target bombers (relentlessly) like terminators.

 

Here it is.

 

  • Heavy Fighters’ priorities have been changed. Now they won't hunt bombers all battle long but will attack sectors: Military Base, Command Center, Airbase, and so on.

    I have been meaning to bring this to the attention of the forum for a while now. Heavy bot fighters still act as terminators, they lock on to bombers and relentlessly attack, and even after they are killed, they re-spawn and very often fly a direct line right back to the bomber they attacked before. Often the terminator heavy bot fighter will ignore enemy caps and ignore enemy planes while they fly straight for the bomber they have targeted. 

 

    I have watched heavies after being destroyed by my bomber re-spawn and fly straight to my bombers location, even if it is all the way across the map. Oh it is "Craig" the bot heavy fighter, good I destroyed him, (60 seconds later), oh it's "Craig" the heavy bot fighter again, ok I destroyed him, (another 60 seconds later), and while my bomber has a thread of health left, guess what? That's right, it's "Craig" the freaking heavy bot fighter again. This time Craig kicks my a**. 

 

    Also, I have watched bot heavies literally follow my bomber around the map for the whole battle, but because the particular bot heavy has trouble keeping altitude with my bomber, they bob around just below me, taking random pot shots. I've watched these bot heavies ignore other planes and caps because I have purposely flown over traffic and dog fights to see if they will break off, and most of the time they don't. I've also seen bot heavy fighters specifically come up from lower altitudes (while over a cap) to try and shoot at my bomber while there was other targets below of other plane types.

 

    Next, I and other players have seen what I would describe as bizarre and erratic heavy bot fighter behavior. I've seen bot heavies line up behind my bomber and start firing, but before I do any significant damage back with my tail or turret guns, the bot heavy fighter breaks off, circles around, comes back, fires just a few times and leaves, then a few minutes later the bot heavy fighter is back, repeats, and then mysteriously flies off with most of their health intact. Now I know this seems to contradict the whole terminator bot behavior, but let me make this clear, this does not happen very often at all, but when it does, it is very confusing for the bomber player since bots usually only veer off after they have had a lot of their health eliminated. A few times all the bot heavy had to do was shoot me since I was very low in hit points, and they would just mysteriously disengage. 

 

    I'm personally just bringing this forward because I was under the impression that bots were not supposed to behave like terminators, unless their name is "Craig". I'm capable of defending my bomber and dealing with the relentless challenge of the killer bots, but I have to really wonder how this affects other bomber players or do these heavies also target other plane types he same way??? I'm so used to it that I expect the onslaught of the heavy bot fighters in every match that I look at what kind of heavies the other team has and who is flying them, be it bots or humans because I know then how to approach the battle in altitude and what caps to attack first. 

 

    I know some people and players think flying bombers is easy and takes limited skill. Do you have any idea what it is like to have to defend your plane against one or two (sometimes more) enemy heavies and fighters while trying to bomb ground targets effectively??? These heavy fighters, whether they are human pilots or bots are killers! They out gun bombers 10 to 1 in firepower and are far more maneuverable as well. Many of them can go as high as bombers and are much faster! For a bomber to survive these attacks is amazing, and to actually shoot these planes down while using pea shooters compared to their cannons is also quite amazing. So please have some respect for the fact that the bomber has every disadvantage except maybe going to a high altitude at certain tiers. It is not as easy as some people think it is. 

 

Prenzlau

 

/sarc

I'm so glad I have biggly stock in Alcoa and Reynolds...

between you and hhj I don't know who's worse.

first we're all living in "the machine"

now "the machine" is hunting you

.

.

.

you flood these forums with a new conspiracy theory every day

now you expect us to believe the dev's didn't keep their promises...

not buying it...

show proof or something

sarc/

:popcorn:

 


if the pilot's good, see, I mean, if he's really..sharp, he can barrel that baby in so low [he spreads his arms like wings and laughs],

you oughtta see it sometime, it's a sight. A big plane like a '52. VRROOM! There's jet exhaust, fryin' chickens in the barnyard.


LMG #3 Posted 12 December 2018 - 08:09 PM

    Second Lieutenant

  • Member
  • 2436 battles
  • 1,846
  • Member since:
    01-26-2012

The furthest I've seen a bot heavy turn towards one of my Bombers has been a little over 3km (aka, purposely headhunting range). He only turned around after whoever was spotting me died, while a pair of bot GAAs were lolling next to him :unsure:


This is my IL-2 (t). There are many like it, but this one is mine. :child:

nwlxn12 #4 Posted 12 December 2018 - 08:47 PM

    Senior Master Sergeant

  • Member
  • 1408 battles
  • 314
  • Member since:
    01-01-2012
I don't see the problem.  Seems to be no different than bot fighters locking onto me.  Many times I have shot down a bot fighter only to have it find me after re-spawning.  Are you, and WG with that statement, saying bombers should get treated differently than other classes of planes?  I see bombers getting attacked as well as flying out there without a tail in many matches.

bradk62 #5 Posted 12 December 2018 - 08:50 PM

    Senior Master Sergeant

  • Member
  • 3700 battles
  • 111
  • [335TH] 335TH
  • Member since:
    08-03-2013

View PostPrenzlau, on 12 December 2018 - 07:29 PM, said:

 

    I know some people and players think flying bombers is easy and takes limited skill.

 

I confess, I used to think this way.

 

Got my first bomber two days ago now that WG added some bombers to the tech tree and I can have one without paying or wasting an entire weekend trying to "earn" one. 

 

Trust me, it's not easy - especially at tier 5.


Edited by bradk62, 12 December 2018 - 08:56 PM.


nwlxn12 #6 Posted 12 December 2018 - 08:52 PM

    Senior Master Sergeant

  • Member
  • 1408 battles
  • 314
  • Member since:
    01-01-2012

View Postbradk62, on 12 December 2018 - 02:50 PM, said:

 

I confess, I used to think this way.

 

Got my first bomber two days ago now that WG added some bombers to the tech tree and I can have one without paying or wasting an entire weekend trying to "earn" one. 

 

Trust me, it's not easy.  

 

My argument is not about how easy it may or may not be to play a bomber.  My argument is that a well played bomber has more effect on the outcome of a match than any other well played class of plane.

Prenzlau #7 Posted 12 December 2018 - 09:44 PM

    Command Chief Master Sergeant

  • Member
  • 8695 battles
  • 929
  • [OWSS] OWSS
  • Member since:
    12-14-2015

View Postnwlxn12, on 12 December 2018 - 02:52 PM, said:

 

My argument is not about how easy it may or may not be to play a bomber.  My argument is that a well played bomber has more effect on the outcome of a match than any other well played class of plane.

 

    I don't know what is worse, relentless terminator heavy bots or relentless people who post but cannot understand what I have said. Lets rewind. WG said this in their October update 2.0.7

 

  • Heavy Fighters’ priorities have been changed. Now they won't hunt bombers all battle long but will attack sectors: Military Base, Command Center, Airbase, and so on.

   By the way, that sounds like an admission to the fact that previously, bot heavies were terminators that "hunted bombers all battle long". 

 

   I'm saying that is not true, that heavy bot fighters still hunt bombers and exclude other targets such as other planes and attacking enemy caps. So I am asking two things. 

 

    First is WG aware that their heavies are still relentlessly targeting bombers and ignoring other targets? Second, Are other players that fly bombers aware of this, or am I just really, really special. 

 

   To your point. 

 

My argument is that a well played bomber has more effect on the outcome of a match than any other well played class of plane.

 

I agree! Bombers are very effective tactically at taking sectors and even more effective if they have a skilled player flying them. That is not my point however. 

 

    You also said...

 

I don't see the problem.  Seems to be no different than bot fighters locking onto me.  Many times I have shot down a bot fighter only to have it find me after re-spawning.  Are you, and WG with that statement, saying bombers should get treated differently than other classes of planes?  I see bombers getting attacked as well as flying out there without a tail in many matches. 

 

    No I'm not saying bombers should get special treatment or have any immunity to being attacked. There is a difference between being a "target of opportunity" because you are in an area or you come within range of a bot heavy VERSUS a bot specifically targeting your bomber and then doing nothing else but attacking your plane. Yes this does not happen every battle, but it happens quite a bit. If a bot heavy re-spawns and flies directly back to attack the bomber that shot it down, thus avoiding all other targets and caps, it is a terminator. The human version could be called a "head hunter". 

 

    I'm suspecting that players who have a lot of experience in bombers will understand, and other players will have more difficulty fully understanding. 

 

Prenzlau

 

 


Edited by Prenzlau, 12 December 2018 - 09:46 PM.

 

 

 

 


zuquizu #8 Posted 12 December 2018 - 09:59 PM

    Airman Basic

  • Member
  • 560 battles
  • 4
  • [AZTKZ] AZTKZ
  • Member since:
    02-23-2015

View PostPrenzlau, on 12 December 2018 - 09:44 PM, said:

 

   I agree! Bombers are very effective tactically at taking sectors and even more effective if they have a skilled player flying them. That is not my point however. 

 

 

 

im also agree with that point some heavy bot or player need take down the bombers because that....but your point is the lack of intelligence of the bots for take desitions, to see the time wasted crossing the map only for chase a bomber....maybe there is a fighter closest to the bomber so the bot not need pursue bomber, and some intelligence for take a viable altitude before the attack over the bomber....

your point is the "decisions" taken by the bots...but you agree about the bombers need be destroyed or attacked by someone (bot or not)

just curious about your opinion of that



Reitousair #9 Posted 12 December 2018 - 10:02 PM

    Command Chief Master Sergeant

  • Member
  • 8955 battles
  • 596
  • [HVAR] HVAR
  • Member since:
    08-10-2013

HF bots love to headhunt bomber players just like MRF bots like to headhunt players in any style of fighter. :sceptic:

 

Seriously, why is there a Fw-190 D bot stalling out behind my fighter getting shot to bits but attempting to attack me in my P-51K? It's quite annoying, for sure, but there are some bot behavior types which cause them to become extremely vengeful or will focus players extremely hard it seems.


I do fly Chinese aircraft a fair amount so... *ahem*

CHINA NUMBAH WAN

 

I even made a custom skin for my IL-10M!

 


GonerNL #10 Posted 12 December 2018 - 10:50 PM

    Command Chief Master Sergeant

  • Member
  • 875 battles
  • 977
  • Member since:
    01-17-2018

View Postnwlxn12, on 12 December 2018 - 09:47 PM, said:

Seems to be no different than bot fighters locking onto me. 

 

That is exactly the problem ... how does the bot knows where to find you ??

If you want to hunt someone down, you would have to fly and look all over the map. The bot just gets your GPS coordinates from the program ...


Flying on NA and EU servers

Twindwarfs #11 Posted 13 December 2018 - 01:14 AM

    Master Sergeant

  • Member
  • 3689 battles
  • 59
  • Member since:
    11-21-2017

According to your description, you shoot down the heavy fighter at least two times in a row without a single death.

 

I don't understand, really, why you are still complaining, given that the best fighters in this game are bombers.

 

Heavy fighters are supposed to intercept bombers. These bots behaviors look bizarre because they are literally suiciding when hunting bombers. So what about this, let's make it historically accurate: Whenever they come and hunt you, you got shot down immediately with no time for return fire? Then these bots won't look bizarre because they are doing their job.

 

Please stop crying. Bombers are already strong enough in this game. Get intercepted frequently is part of bombers' gameplay. If you cannot handle it or cannot tolerate it, then just don't play bombers. 



sandtiger #12 Posted 13 December 2018 - 01:22 AM

    Second Lieutenant

  • Member
  • 17399 battles
  • 1,172
  • Member since:
    04-25-2011

i had match at tier ten where i had 3 bvp with there rockets all gunning  for me ... no mater where i went there they where .. they where not human i check so i have seen the hunter bots again ..  they have reprogrammed the bots  so many times i sure there is   errors that happen and i think the hunter bots are one of the errors ,

i have also  been in my   new  US   bomber and i have had 5 Bots on  ,me all at once .. so the bots are being strange again ...

also some where in the many patch notes they said they not going to have bot bombers attack the main  target  of the red teams base  so for an example i was play a match and there was two cc ...the  red team bot bomber came all the way across the map and attacked the cc on my side of the map an this was also  not  suppose to happen but it is happening  so i have to agree

 Prenzlau 

there is also a lot of people get black screens ,.. game crash ... freezing  ...... low ping ... of late ... i starting to thinks there gearing up and new patch or event but i am not sure ...



sandtiger #13 Posted 13 December 2018 - 01:32 AM

    Second Lieutenant

  • Member
  • 17399 battles
  • 1,172
  • Member since:
    04-25-2011

just question why is it ok for some to talk about what they see and then when others speak about what they see its cry ...

it like if someone   feel different or see something that maybe your not see because you have not put that many hours in to bombing or be a ga or fighter or heavy plane 

that because you have not seen something that the person  who typing is cry ...  he just put down what he saw with his own two eyes while play a game

it not like he is  yelling or be mean he just put his thought on here  just as we all do ...

just a though read what people put down think about it  put your own ideas down

and maybe have a a conversion not a back an forth .. i find this topic interesting 

and i think the bots are acting up again... i wounder what is on the way next ...

 


Edited by sandtiger, 13 December 2018 - 01:35 AM.


sandtiger #14 Posted 13 December 2018 - 01:38 AM

    Second Lieutenant

  • Member
  • 17399 battles
  • 1,172
  • Member since:
    04-25-2011

you are not the only on that had them come at you 

i had a set of 3 bvp chase me all over the map in my ga

and i seen many of the things you are peak of here


Edited by sandtiger, 13 December 2018 - 02:50 AM.


Twindwarfs #15 Posted 13 December 2018 - 01:54 AM

    Master Sergeant

  • Member
  • 3689 battles
  • 59
  • Member since:
    11-21-2017

View Postsandtiger, on 13 December 2018 - 01:32 AM, said:

just question why is it ok for some to talk about what they see and then when others speak about what they see its cry ...

it like if someone   feel different or see something that maybe your not see because you have not put that many hours in to bombing or be a ga or fighter or heavy plane 

that because you have not seen something that the person  who typing is cry ...  he just put down what he saw with his own two eyes while play a game

it not like he is  yelling or be mean he just put his thought on here  just as we all do ...

just a though read what people put down think about it  put your own ideas down

and maybe have a a conversion not a back an forth .. i find this topic interesting 

and i think the bots are acting up again... i wounder what is on the way next ...

 

 

 I'm not saying the topic is not interesting, I totally agree with what Prenzlau proposed that the way these bots hunting bombers should be improved. But at the current state, there are more serious issues for the developers to consider, like crashes, respawn bugs. The AI for bomber hunting is not perfect, but it's fine, at least for me. 

 

Besides, could you please not interpret "crying" as "baby cry" or  "yelling"... I mean no offense when using that word.


Edited by STJ_12, 13 December 2018 - 01:59 AM.


Ace_BOTlistic_Cosmo #16 Posted 13 December 2018 - 02:09 AM

    Captain

  • Member
  • 858 battles
  • 4,033
  • [3NIC] 3NIC
  • Member since:
    01-26-2014
pooop

if the pilot's good, see, I mean, if he's really..sharp, he can barrel that baby in so low [he spreads his arms like wings and laughs],

you oughtta see it sometime, it's a sight. A big plane like a '52. VRROOM! There's jet exhaust, fryin' chickens in the barnyard.


Prenzlau #17 Posted 13 December 2018 - 02:25 AM

    Command Chief Master Sergeant

  • Member
  • 8695 battles
  • 929
  • [OWSS] OWSS
  • Member since:
    12-14-2015

View PostSTJ_12, on 12 December 2018 - 07:14 PM, said:

According to your description, you shoot down the heavy fighter at least two times in a row without a single death.

 

I don't understand, really, why you are still complaining, given that the best fighters in this game are bombers.

 

Heavy fighters are supposed to intercept bombers. These bots behaviors look bizarre because they are literally suiciding when hunting bombers. So what about this, let's make it historically accurate: Whenever they come and hunt you, you got shot down immediately with no time for return fire? Then these bots won't look bizarre because they are doing their job.

 

Please stop crying. Bombers are already strong enough in this game. Get intercepted frequently is part of bombers' gameplay. If you cannot handle it or cannot tolerate it, then just don't play bombers. 

 

    I'm not complaining. I'm showing evidence that WG said in an update that heavy bot fighter behavior would change, and I'm asserting that it has not. I'm also interested in getting more evidence or validation that this is in fact happening to other people, especially people who play bombers. 

 

    Yes, of course heavy fighters attack bombers. The heavy bots do not suicide, they attack and veer off, restore some health, and circle back and attack again, normally. Please do not bring in anything that is "historical" because this is a fantasy game, and it is mostly full of historical flaws, so why be selective at all. 

 

    It amazes me how people can read what I write and still have little or no understanding to the point I am making?!? Either that or they just skim over it and just say whatever pops into their mind and miss what I am saying. 

 

    I'm not going to address in any detail what you wrote in your final statements because obviously you don't know me or my prowess with flying bombers. 

 

 

Prenzlau

    


Edited by Prenzlau, 13 December 2018 - 02:28 AM.

 

 

 

 


Prenzlau #18 Posted 13 December 2018 - 02:31 AM

    Command Chief Master Sergeant

  • Member
  • 8695 battles
  • 929
  • [OWSS] OWSS
  • Member since:
    12-14-2015

View PostAce_BOTlistic_Cosmo, on 12 December 2018 - 08:09 PM, said:

pooop

 

I have to admit... I was thinking of poop as well... just when I'm convinced that I don't like you, you say something that ropes me back into the "I think maybe, possibly I could learn to like Ace, but..." category. 

 

I actually was going to use the term nincompoop to describe someone in this thread, but I need to have better self control when it comes to insults. But poop seems to be the common word.

 

Prenzlau


 

 

 

 


sandtiger #19 Posted 13 December 2018 - 02:37 AM

    Second Lieutenant

  • Member
  • 17399 battles
  • 1,172
  • Member since:
    04-25-2011

View PostSTJ_12, on 12 December 2018 - 05:54 PM, said:

 

 I'm not saying the topic is not interesting, I totally agree with what Prenzlau proposed that the way these bots hunting bombers should be improved. But at the current state, there are more serious issues for the developers to consider, like crashes, respawn bugs. The AI for bomber hunting is not perfect, but it's fine, at least for me. 

 

Besides, could you please not interpret "crying" as "baby cry" or  "yelling"... I mean no offense when using that word.

 

to m e your comment or cry as a baby cry  or yelling is insulting and i am not yelling at you it was  me see what you wrote ..take your  words for what they are used for all over this forum ... most people and  i for  one  take these worse as an insults Besides, could you please not interpret "crying" as "baby cry" or  "yelling"... I mean no offense when using that word.

for one i was not crying i was merely point out your comment is yelling and cry about some one opinion as you are here now cry at me  because i  put in a thought of my own this is a great example  of what i was just talking about so thank you ..now i can show what it like to others good job man thanks for the help in make my point more clear  


Edited by sandtiger, 13 December 2018 - 02:43 AM.


sandtiger #20 Posted 13 December 2018 - 02:45 AM

    Second Lieutenant

  • Member
  • 17399 battles
  • 1,172
  • Member since:
    04-25-2011

Prenzlau

you are better then need to respond to a trolling

it not worth your time

or the waste  energy to talk this out   i found this post interesting thank your sharing it


Edited by sandtiger, 13 December 2018 - 02:47 AM.





1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users