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simple idea for a mode to reduce flight OPness


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trikke #1 Posted 19 October 2018 - 05:44 PM

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not that we don't already have enough modes now...    but here's a simple-to-code idea i had

 

a bot wingman for everyone!    even the team-filler bots get one

 

everyone gets a LF loose cover wingman... GAs, heavies, bombers, MRs and even other LF

 

headhunting a human?   watch out for his bot guardian angel

 

the angel bots would have no visible ID... only the wingman leader will know who his wingman is

 

probably have to reduce the size of each team to six, to cover the extra server cpu load

 

i would assume that flights wouldn't get angels, but that probably wouldn't be an issue... maybe flights wouldn't be allowed in?

 

what do you guys think?

 

 


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Wombatmetal #2 Posted 19 October 2018 - 06:34 PM

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A lot of MMOs do it. Can I give my angel a name?

wylleEcoyote #3 Posted 19 October 2018 - 06:43 PM

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Fair warning. My success rate at speculative guesswork is much like my WinRate. Hit or Miss.
Usually I start on the right track and then a make a weird left turn and get lost in the weeds ... 
And yet it doesn't stop me from speculation.

Specialist Planes I have from : Japan, USA, UK, Germany, USSR, Europe
Light Fighters:   XP-31, Model 81A-1, P-40, P-51A, P-39N-1, XF15C, DH.100 F1, Fw 56, He 112, Bf 109 B / E / E-3 / F, Me209v4, Me209 A, I-17
Multi-Roles: Type 91, F11C-2, F4F, P-47B, Fw 190 A-1 / A-5 / D, I- 5 / 15 / 16(e)(l)

Heavy Fighters: P-38 F/J,  XP-58, Beaufighter,  Bf 110 C-6, Me 410, Do 335 A-1, Me 262, Tu-1, SE 100,

Attack Aircraft: Hs 123, Ha 137, Hs 129 A, Ju 87 G, Me 265, Me 1099 B-2
Bombers: Do 17 Z, He 111 H2, Pe-2, Do 217 M
 


wylleEcoyote #4 Posted 19 October 2018 - 06:51 PM

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That angel is probably gonna be a bog standard air defence bot of the appropriate Nationality and Tier.
And that is a bit underwhelming.

Heavies and bombers get a heavy. Its the only thing that can keep up speed and altitude wise.
Everyone else could get a light.

And team disposition is gonna get really strange.  five humans playing light fighters means 10 light fighters on one side
this would lead to a roflstomp for anything with the altitude to hard counter that team

Fair warning. My success rate at speculative guesswork is much like my WinRate. Hit or Miss.
Usually I start on the right track and then a make a weird left turn and get lost in the weeds ... 
And yet it doesn't stop me from speculation.

Specialist Planes I have from : Japan, USA, UK, Germany, USSR, Europe
Light Fighters:   XP-31, Model 81A-1, P-40, P-51A, P-39N-1, XF15C, DH.100 F1, Fw 56, He 112, Bf 109 B / E / E-3 / F, Me209v4, Me209 A, I-17
Multi-Roles: Type 91, F11C-2, F4F, P-47B, Fw 190 A-1 / A-5 / D, I- 5 / 15 / 16(e)(l)

Heavy Fighters: P-38 F/J,  XP-58, Beaufighter,  Bf 110 C-6, Me 410, Do 335 A-1, Me 262, Tu-1, SE 100,

Attack Aircraft: Hs 123, Ha 137, Hs 129 A, Ju 87 G, Me 265, Me 1099 B-2
Bombers: Do 17 Z, He 111 H2, Pe-2, Do 217 M
 


trikke #5 Posted 19 October 2018 - 08:37 PM

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the angel bot would be programmed to fire only on pilots that slide in behind the flight leader, and could not be ordered to "go cap that CC"

 

and they would be no help at all on deflection shots

 

so... figure out who the angel bot is for that guy is first, then kill it

 

then, kill the guy who should have been watching out for his wingman 

 

edit:  just like in ww2?


Edited by trikke, 19 October 2018 - 08:38 PM.

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poppavein #6 Posted 19 October 2018 - 08:54 PM

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I like it.  At the least, have the bots react to the F2 and F7 callouts .

vcharng #7 Posted 19 October 2018 - 11:45 PM

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Sounds interesting... but better test it before actually introducing it.

trikke #8 Posted 19 October 2018 - 11:55 PM

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View Postvcharng, on 19 October 2018 - 07:45 PM, said:

Sounds interesting... but better test it before actually introducing it.

 

guaranteed that someone in RU will figure out how to game this...

 

but i trust WG to plug the holes in this mode with updates!

 

(okay, i see the irony in that statement as soon as i typed it)


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Bobby_Tables #9 Posted 20 October 2018 - 02:12 AM

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I can just see in my mind the posts from the HHJ type player "My Angel Bots suck and the enemy's Angel Bots are all OP!!!".

 

In concept, an interesting idea.  In practice, meh.  The programming to make this happen is intense, and keep in mind the developers like to make pretty pictures not program intelligent AI.  And... since the Angel Bot would "slide in" on anyone attacking the human, there's a simple solution, kill the Angel Bot then kill the human.  If I was in a flight I would totally exploit this.  IRL, a lot of the times fighters would go for the wingman and then the lead.  

 

And what about GA or bombers?  The Angel Bot (if a LF) would be torn to shreds by AA, unless WG made them impervious to AA (queue the complaints about THAT). 

 

IMO, flights are not that OP unless you are up against two honchos and then, well, yeah it sucks.  But in the game as it is, flights really don't intimidate me unless I know the two players are real good.  In 1.X, flights had much more "OPness" because the deathmatch aspect meant that teamwork significantly improved your odds.  In these modes, there are more ways to win than just killing all the planes, so the concept of Angels would appeal to pure fighter players, but less so to those who mix and match what plane type they play.   

 

I wouldn't mind it if it happened, but it could open up a whole 'nuther can of worms.  



Captain_Underpants53 #10 Posted 20 October 2018 - 09:27 AM

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View Posttrikke, on 19 October 2018 - 06:55 PM, said:

 

guaranteed that someone in RU will figure out how to game this...

 

but i trust WG to plug the holes in this mode with updates!

 

(okay, i see the irony in that statement as soon as i typed it)

 

LOL.  Too true!

 

:medal:


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trikke #11 Posted 20 October 2018 - 01:17 PM

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View PostBobby_Tables, on 19 October 2018 - 10:12 PM, said:

I can just see in my mind the posts from the HHJ type player "My Angel Bots suck and the enemy's Angel Bots are all OP!!!".

 

In concept, an interesting idea.  In practice, meh.  The programming to make this happen is intense, and keep in mind the developers like to make pretty pictures not program intelligent AI.  And... since the Angel Bot would "slide in" on anyone attacking the human, there's a simple solution, kill the Angel Bot then kill the human.  If I was in a flight I would totally exploit this.  IRL, a lot of the times fighters would go for the wingman and then the lead.  

 

And what about GA or bombers?  The Angel Bot (if a LF) would be torn to shreds by AA, unless WG made them impervious to AA (queue the complaints about THAT). 

 

IMO, flights are not that OP unless you are up against two honchos and then, well, yeah it sucks.  But in the game as it is, flights really don't intimidate me unless I know the two players are real good.  In 1.X, flights had much more "OPness" because the deathmatch aspect meant that teamwork significantly improved your odds.  In these modes, there are more ways to win than just killing all the planes, so the concept of Angels would appeal to pure fighter players, but less so to those who mix and match what plane type they play.   

 

I wouldn't mind it if it happened, but it could open up a whole 'nuther can of worms.  

 

i see your point       i was just trying to give the devs a completely different idea for a mode, that's not too hard to work with 

 

one of the challenges would be to identify each pilots' angel (there would be no visible linkage), then remember which angel belonged to which pilot throughout the battle, by name

 

then, you would have to get to the angel without being noticed, as he(she?) would fly above and behind the leader, or sometimes immediately above

 

maybe the leader would get an red on-screen notice that his wingman was being shot, similar to the "enemy behind you" we see now?

 

but the angel is always above, because diving on you when you are attacking his leader closes distance instantly 

 

bombers and GAs would benefit the most, LFs and MRs the least... and that's just fine with everyone, i'll bet

 

programming would be easier than current AI coding...   much much MUCH less code than current bot programming 

 

your personal angel would get a shimmering white paint job, only visible to you      talk about appropriate!    let the WG artists work on that

 

yep, folks would complain loudly about their bot wingman, but their bot wingmen wouldn't get their feelings hurt

 

edit:  who knows...  human wingmen like me could be replaced by in-game robots    which would be a dream come true for my flight partner SpiritFoxMY   lol


Edited by trikke, 20 October 2018 - 01:25 PM.

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