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109G Gustav in tier 7


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trikke #1 Posted 25 April 2018 - 01:29 PM

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just today i worked up to it, with all the modules, but haven't had the time to fly it yet

 

if i'm a confirmed turn fighter, with only two months total experience in LF BnZ with 109s and mustangs  (tons of HF bnz, though)

 

i've loved these past two months, what a fun new world has been opened up for me!

 

 

but...  have i Peter Principled myself up into a tier with a specialized thoroughbred plane that requires a BnZ PhD?

 

i just don't see many Gustavs in my T7 battles...  the bots do seem to love to fly them, but that's it

 

should i stay all 20s?   or run the 30?        i've got marksman one and two on the pilot, and the reflector gunsight

 

i've been watching G videos, but most videos i watch just serve up a steaming dish of there's-no-way-you-can-do-that inadequacy...  sigh

 


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pyantoryng #2 Posted 25 April 2018 - 01:54 PM

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If you stay all 20...where the heck did you get the gondolas, because you can only have one 20 in the nose...in the slot where the 30 is supposed to go in.

 

I ran 30 with two ranks of Marksman+gunsight with mine back when I had it...helped with the last stretch before I moved onto 209, which is MUCH better...just react accordingly to the situation. Hell, I can't even recall actively BnZing with that junk.



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soydivision #3 Posted 25 April 2018 - 02:19 PM

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I found the G challenging.  Flies great, but I've always hated the short range 30mm and had issues finishing planes off before they could drop to the ground.  If I had to fly it again, I'd prob focus more on my aim.   



SpiritFoxMY #4 Posted 25 April 2018 - 02:20 PM

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Pretty much as I mentioned, the G is decent enough if you can hit targets with that 30 consistently. Its basically similar to the Freidrich both in playstyle and firepower. The Messer line are vertical hybrid fighters with a decent horizontal turning rate; much like the Mustang. They aren't PURE boom and zoom and you can still mix it up with multiroles and even some of the less nimble fighters like the P-51D and I-220. Just be warned that they both pack considerably more firepower than you do.

 

As for the choice between 20 and 30 - I strongly recommend the 30 unless you're expecting to only duel other fighters and multiroles. 


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hoom #5 Posted 25 April 2018 - 02:25 PM

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I'm also new to it, still on 2nd engine & stock airframe but the 30mm felt like a huge firepower improvement, with the 20mm you're basically just a faster, higher-tier version of the already under-gunned 109 F.

Haven't really tried to BnZ with it, maybe will with the top engine.

Have been basically treating the 30mm as a quicker firing version of the P-39n-1/XFL-1 37mm ie lead a lot & fire it as single click per shot rather than hold-down bursts, seems to work well.


Edited by hoom, 25 April 2018 - 02:30 PM.

C'est magnifique, mais ce n'est pas le SerB.

Reitousair #6 Posted 25 April 2018 - 10:30 PM

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The Bf-109 G is an energy fighter. So you can TnB and BnZ pretty well, but it's mostly a matter of getting the enemy low on energy and coming back in for the kill, not a playstyle that's easily figured out

 

I'd recommend getting Marksman 2 on your pilot ASAP along with a gunsight. After that I would recommend engine tuning and a lightweight airframe to increase your energy-retention and dogfighting capabilities. Use the 30 on it, it's the 109 G's specialty over the 109 F, just get in real close and pull the trigger! You'll want to pack a pneumatic restarter and a dressing pack for sure, what you want after that is up to you.

 

The 109 G is a really good plane once you fully upgrade it, but I will admit it's an utter scrap heap stock, just keep at it and see if you can figure how how to energy fight with it. Hold optimal as much as possible if you get into a straight horizontal turning battle, but try and break out of it and use your energy-retention to your advantage, a 109 G is pretty hard to keep up with in a dogfight once it breaks a horizontal turning battle.


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YagabodooN #7 Posted 26 April 2018 - 01:16 AM

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I could never get over Gustav's lack of gun power, it just can't take advantage of its energy like other planes can, the p51D is superior and it doesn't even have a cannon. 

trikke #8 Posted 26 April 2018 - 02:04 AM

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View PostSpiritFoxMY, on 25 April 2018 - 09:20 AM, said:

Pretty much as I mentioned, the G is decent enough if you can hit targets with that 30 consistently. Its basically similar to the Freidrich both in playstyle and firepower. The Messer line are vertical hybrid fighters with a decent horizontal turning rate; much like the Mustang. They aren't PURE boom and zoom and you can still mix it up with multiroles and even some of the less nimble fighters like the P-51D and I-220. Just be warned that they both pack considerably more firepower than you do.

 

As for the choice between 20 and 30 - I strongly recommend the 30 unless you're expecting to only duel other fighters and multiroles. 

 

Well, you are stuck with me tomorrow, because I'm flying it until the paint all peels off!
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SpiritFoxMY #9 Posted 26 April 2018 - 03:10 AM

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View Posttrikke, on 26 April 2018 - 02:04 AM, said:

 

Well, you are stuck with me tomorrow, because I'm flying it until the paint all peels off!

 

I have my own Gustav to work on and I unlocked the 51D on Tues as well ;)

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trikke #10 Posted 30 April 2018 - 01:39 PM

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first flight last week went fairly well, but i certainly faced stronger planes and more experienced pilots

 

8500-ish cp, 7 kills... so i contributed to the win, but this is just not a get-in-and-fly-it-well plane, even with many fun weeks of BnZ training 

 

that big, slow gun meant that i followed targets around until i finally got the lead angle right, which caused my flight partner SpiritFoxMY to have to clear my tail too many times

 

whereas i have some kind of sixth sense on how far to swing the nose around to connect quickly in the p-39s and the p-38f, i flat out struggled to hit even the fattest slowest targets 

 

 

i might step back from 30mm to the 20mm, against the advice of several excellent pilots... good advice i trust completely 

 

because, of course, i think that i'm right and they're wrong...  which just about sums up my looong string of less-than-stellar life choices

 

 


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hoom #11 Posted 01 May 2018 - 02:15 AM

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 whereas i have some kind of sixth sense on how far to swing the nose around to connect quickly in the p-39s and the p-38f, i flat out struggled to hit even the fattest slowest targets 

 Weird, feels very much like the 37mm to me :unsure:


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MadJackChurchil #12 Posted 01 May 2018 - 03:35 AM

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That 30 mm is a slug, but I think its worthy in the end. Personally I was refusing to play with it until I started to play Me262 - the plane I can recommend to anyone for improving their game play (ignore my evil smile here). Although I (mostly - have my bright moments) struggle playing that plane, it dramatically improved my gameplay for 109G (that gun is suddenly not that slow), Mosquito (suddenly it feels less like a brick) and Me265 (which I play almost like a fighter after 262).

 

Spirit: P51D is a jewel in the sky (for me the most beautiful plane of WW2). Not overpowered, but very forgiving - consistent fire (doesnt matter if you miss here and there), ok-ish manuverability, good speed and height performance.... not boom & zoomer, but play like a normal fighter and if some more maneuverable jerk (hate you, Spits) gets on your tale, escape high or fast. Nice and easy.


Edited by MadJackChurchil, 01 May 2018 - 03:40 AM.


hoom #13 Posted 01 May 2018 - 08:38 AM

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 Personally I was refusing to play with it until I started to play Me262

 Good point: aside from the outright firepower, a good reason to use the 30mm is that so many German planes use it.


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LMG #14 Posted 01 May 2018 - 08:40 AM

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View Posthoom, on 01 May 2018 - 03:38 AM, said:

 Good point: aside from the outright firepower, a good reason to use the 30mm is that so many German planes use it.

 

Germans have 30s, Soviets have 23s and 37s, americans have 20s and 12.7s


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SpiritFoxMY #15 Posted 01 May 2018 - 09:04 AM

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View Posthoom, on 01 May 2018 - 04:38 PM, said:

 Good point: aside from the outright firepower, a good reason to use the 30mm is that so many German planes use it.

 

Well, M is going down the Messer line and that actually has very few 30s - only the Gustav and the following 209 which uses a different 30 (the long-range single shot MK103) and then goes on to 20mm revolvers.

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And a laurel to crown each end


MadJackChurchil #16 Posted 01 May 2018 - 08:55 PM

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View PostSpiritFoxMY, on 01 May 2018 - 09:04 AM, said:

 

Well, M is going down the Messer line and that actually has very few 30s - only the Gustav and the following 209 which uses a different 30 (the long-range single shot MK103) and then goes on to 20mm revolvers.

 

Going to Me262 from the Messer line is not too difficult - just play E a bit longer to get 109Z. You can then either learn with 30mm on that plane, or, like me, you can play it as a very decent long-range sniper with 20mm and ridiculous climb rate and then get to Me262, start screaming in agony and slowly learn the 30 mm there.

Anyway, I think I can, sometimes, hit with 30mm on fully upgraded 109G and I still feel like grinding it a bit.



trikke #17 Posted 03 May 2018 - 06:42 PM

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sigh...  okay, i'll switch back and forth for a while, because i can

 

RL Gustav pilots didn't get any choices, they had to go with what was given to them, so i'm just being a big baby here

 

didn't get a chance to fly it today, and next chance will be monday, so i'm going to run it a bunch of battles in a row then

 

i just loved the b,e and f so much... i just hoping the G will not become a beautiful hangar queen that never gets flown

 

i've got enough of those

 

 


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hoom #18 Posted 04 May 2018 - 02:23 AM

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 Well, M is going down the Messer line and that actually has very few 30s - only the Gustav and the following 209 which uses a different 30 (the long-range single shot MK103) and then goes on to 20mm revolvers.

 Yeah but there are lots of MK 108s through the tree which presumably have similar characteristics to the one on the 109 G -> good practice for when going down those other lines (109 line is actually my first German line so maybe I'm wrong)

 

Block Quote

 i just loved the b,e and f so much... i just hoping the G will not become a beautiful hangar queen that never gets flown

 I loved the B, didn't entirely enjoy the E... until I got the F and instantly realised the E had superb firepower that I now missed dearly, I definitely like G much better than the F and its specifically because of the hard hitting 30mm.

 


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SpiritFoxMY #19 Posted 04 May 2018 - 04:16 AM

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View Posthoom, on 04 May 2018 - 10:23 AM, said:

 Yeah but there are lots of MK 108s through the tree which presumably have similar characteristics to the one on the 109 G -> good practice for when going down those other lines (109 line is actually my first German line so maybe I'm wrong)

 

 I loved the B, didn't entirely enjoy the E... until I got the F and instantly realised the E had superb firepower that I now missed dearly, I definitely like G much better than the F and its specifically because of the hard hitting 30mm.

 

 

MK108s show up on the Me109z, Me262, Me265, Me329, P.1099B-2, Me410, Fw190D, Ta152, Ta183, Me109TL and Fw190 A-8.

 

So yes, they show up on a lot of German planes but it DOES depend if M wants to follow down those lines - apart from the Gustav, the only other line he's flying with that lot is the 265/329/1099B2 series of GAAs.

 

Emil is my favourite 109 and has been right from the start.

 

-51D is a beauty. Unfortunately I already have the even better -51K so I'll be keeping the latter and selling off the -51D once I'm ready. My hanger is desperately in need of some rationalization. 


***

But a truce to this mournful story

For death is a distant friend

So here's to a life of glory

And a laurel to crown each end


trikke #20 Posted 04 May 2018 - 12:08 PM

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View PostSpiritFoxMY, on 03 May 2018 - 11:16 PM, said:

Emil is my favourite 109 and has been right from the start.

 

my friend Herr Oberst Nu worked so hard trying to teach me to fly to fly the E successfully in the early days of 1.x

 

the E was like both a shiv and a hammer in his hands, and i just couldn't get it

 

for him, it had to be like watching a chimp trying to use a typewriter...  even if i did something correctly in the E, i wouldn't have realized what i was doing and couldn't repeat it

 

so frustrating for both of us, and i quickly developed a mental block against zoomboomers in general, and the 109 line in particular 

 

but now, it's just so different...   i have to deliberately choose other planes to fly, because my 109s sing to me with their enchanting music


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