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My invincible Dornier Do17


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Ronald_Jenkinson #1 Posted 10 April 2018 - 09:56 AM

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So far I've flown 30 missions in a T4 Dornier Do17 bomber and been shot down only 3 times by hostile aircraft. 

 

That's ridiculous.

 

It shouldn't be that hard to shoot down a bomber.  My tactic is simple, climb to 10,000 feet and float around blowing stuff up with impunity.  Occasionally a heavy fighter will struggle up to that altitude and take a shot at me, I just hit the boost, climb a little higher and run away.

 

This is seriously out of whack, once a HF gets me in their sights I should be toast.  ADHFs don't even bother, haven't seen a single one at that altitude.

 

Why are bombers getting such a soft run?



I_QQ_4_U #2 Posted 10 April 2018 - 10:33 AM

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It's Tier 4 that's why, the Blenheim is even worse, there's pretty much no plane that can reach the altitudes they can at those tiers and if they try even it's mediocre tail gun will rip them apart.

SpiritFoxMY #3 Posted 10 April 2018 - 10:49 AM

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Bots are terrible at bombers in general - both flying them and intercepting them. Also, at tier 4 there's only a handful of fighters that can get to you with difficulty - the Bf109, the P-36, the Bf110B and Blenheim F. None of them are the TnB airplanes most people at low tiers are used to. People at that tier tend to flail about at low level unless they're already quite experienced.


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lunber54 #4 Posted 10 April 2018 - 11:10 AM

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Once you unlock the tier 5 and 6 bombers i’d like to know if you think the same way. “ Bombers getting a  soft run” wait till you have p-38’s that come out of nowhere and rip you to shreds.  At tier 6 there are even more enemies that can kill you.  Bombing is a fun gameplay, but in no way is it flawed or “out of whack”. 

lunber54 #5 Posted 10 April 2018 - 11:33 AM

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I am interested to see how other bombers are implemented as in will they be heavy bombers with more hitpoints, or have heavier bomb loads, or maybe both.  

Dr_Wigglespank #6 Posted 10 April 2018 - 11:37 AM

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How effective is your bomber at 10K feet?

Ronald_Jenkinson #7 Posted 10 April 2018 - 11:55 AM

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View PostDr_Wigglespank, on 10 April 2018 - 09:37 PM, said:

How effective is your bomber at 10K feet?

 

I generally hit what I'm aiming at.

Ronald_Jenkinson #8 Posted 10 April 2018 - 12:02 PM

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View Postlunber54, on 10 April 2018 - 09:10 PM, said:

Once you unlock the tier 5 and 6 bombers i’d like to know if you think the same way. “ Bombers getting a  soft run” wait till you have p-38’s that come out of nowhere and rip you to shreds.  At tier 6 there are even more enemies that can kill you.  Bombing is a fun gameplay, but in no way is it flawed or “out of whack”. 

 

​So maybe they should tweak T4 a little so the HFs get a better run at the bombers. 

lunber54 #9 Posted 10 April 2018 - 01:33 PM

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They could do that, but from a gameplay design point of view if a person just wanted to try out bombers and wasn’t sure if they would be worth it and continuously got destroyed in the tier 4 they would not enjoy playing them and stop the line at tier 4.  I wouldn’t say no to buffing tier 4’s altitude performance, but I would rather not change  anything that isn’t actually broken.



GonerNL #10 Posted 10 April 2018 - 01:55 PM

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View PostRonald_Jenkinson, on 10 April 2018 - 11:55 AM, said:

I generally hit what I'm aiming at.

 

Yep, if you slow down and have the bomb-sight and demolition expert skill your bombing is pretty accurate ...

If you want to be really safe, you have to climb pretty high to stay out of reach of the heavies and even higher for the heavy AA which is pretty accurate (too accurate, maybe ...)

 

Bombing can be fun, but the white circle in my bomb-sight disappears every now & then and accurate bombing is impossible without it.


Edited by GonerNL, 10 April 2018 - 01:57 PM.


Dr_Wigglespank #11 Posted 10 April 2018 - 02:09 PM

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View PostGonerNL, on 10 April 2018 - 07:55 AM, said:

 

Yep, if you slow down and have the bomb-sight and demolition expert skill your bombing is pretty accurate ...

If you want to be really safe, you have to climb pretty high to stay out of reach of the heavies and even higher for the heavy AA which is pretty accurate (too accurate, maybe ...)

 

Bombing can be fun, but the white circle in my bomb-sight disappears every now & then and accurate bombing is impossible without it.

 

I've only played around a dozen games in the Do-17Z but I found that sticking to such high altitudes made it much harder to destroy the larger ground targets in one drop, even with the bomb sight and pilot skill. I'd prefer to drop between 6-7K and then climb while the bombs reload.

 

I do realize that with such few games in bombers that I'm no expert and certainly have a lot to learn, so take my thoughts as you will.



SpiritFoxMY #12 Posted 10 April 2018 - 02:55 PM

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View Postlunber54, on 10 April 2018 - 01:33 PM, said:

They could do that, but from a gameplay design point of view if a person just wanted to try out bombers and wasn’t sure if they would be worth it and continuously got destroyed in the tier 4 they would not enjoy playing them and stop the line at tier 4.  I wouldn’t say no to buffing tier 4’s altitude performance, but I would rather not change  anything that isn’t actually broken.

 

Honestly, if you take a look at the planes in tiers 3 and 4, the altitude performance isn't as bad as people assume.

 

Tier III

Bristol Blenheim Mk IV: 1500m optimum

Arado Ar 80 German Light Fighter : 1500m optimum

Focke Wulf Fw 57 German Heavy Fighter : 1500m optimum

Curtiss Hawk 75M American Light Fighter : 1200m optimum

 

Tier IV

Dornier Do17Z: 1500m optimum

Messerschmitt Bf109 B: 1700m optimum

Curtiss P-36 Hawk :  1500m optimum

Messerschmitt Bf110 B : 1700m optimum

Heinkel He 112 : 1200m optimum

Bristol Blenheim F : 1500m optimum

 

In tier 4 alone, you have five separate airplanes with the potential to get in gun range from you - even if you're top tier, there're three potential tier 3 fighters that can take you on. Granted, the Do17Z would probably make mincemeat out of a tier 3 interceptor, but at its tier, the 17Z is not invulnerable. I still feel that a lot of the bomber's dominance at the lower tiers is owed to the shift in meta from tier 3 to tier 4. At tier 3, sure you have the Blenheim IV, but it poses a substantially smaller threat than the Dornier. Most people from tier 1 to 3 are still in the "spin around and around chasing tails" mindset and haven't begun to grasp the importance of altitude and the concept of vertical combat. Tier 4 is where things start to get more diverse and people still haven't adapted to that yet so you still get a lot of people flying in I-17s, Bristol 146s, Zeros and Oscars and what they're doing is spinning around on the deck. Even the Bf 110s are low down, booming through fighter formations. The mindset hasn't shifted to combat at altitude yet.

 

And THAT is why low tier bombers tend to have it easy - the fight is still down low and people who could chase you are still preoccupied with the low-altitude scrums. I don't think they're overly imbalanced. 

 

That's my opinion anyway - I'm not much of a bomber pilot myself.


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And a laurel to crown each end


Kenny_Chung #13 Posted 10 April 2018 - 03:12 PM

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fly too high may be invincible but you are also hard to do your bomber mission

ExploratorOne #14 Posted 10 April 2018 - 03:42 PM

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Lol, I fly all of my bombers between 50 and 300 meters...

SgtSchlautter #15 Posted 10 April 2018 - 05:59 PM

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Sure bombers can go up that high, but your accuracy takes a beating. Even if you are hitting things at that altitude, you are too slow to get from sector to sector quickly and you are not utilizing the bomber to its fullest potential. Only climb up that high to avoid enemy planes. Otherwise, you really should stay at about 5-7k ft as most thing still won't get up that high, your bombs will be more accurate, and you will have greater speed. The german bombers really are not op at all compared to the premium ones. Their defensive capabilities are basically non-existent

Zigfreid #16 Posted 10 April 2018 - 07:01 PM

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LOL +1 Prenzlau OK back on the subject of going 10k high in tier 4 bomber.

What i like is your 5.88 ground targets destroyed per sortie which is good not great.

What i don't like is you placed #1,048 in damage to ground targets could be better.

Dr Wiggles nailed it how effective is your bomber at 10k feet, i think not that good.

You have 5 cluster bomb drops every 2 minutes if the game lasts 8 to 12 minutes

you should have dropped 20 to 30 bombs and you said that you hit what you aim for.

With 5.88 targets destroyed per game with 25 bombs dropped is a little weak, one game

you did 16 targets destroyed which is good should be every game, my best is 29 in that plane.

Next 1 thunder, 1 lang, and 1 doolittle medal you just got your toes wet you really need to jump in.

My credentials are 39 targets destroyed in a bomber in one battle #3 ground targets destroyed,

#2 damage to ground targets on this server, 74 doolittles, 119 langs, 138 thunders. at ease your dismissed.

LOL bombers are fun, but push your self a little it's more fun. <O

 

 


Edited by Zigfreid, 10 April 2018 - 08:15 PM.


Prenzlau #17 Posted 10 April 2018 - 07:05 PM

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View PostZigfreid, on 10 April 2018 - 07:01 PM, said:

i

 

I have to admit! That is the most creative and original post I have ever seen in these forums! 

 

You really are the "Zen Master" I have been looking for!

 

Prenzlau


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NovaTempest #18 Posted 10 April 2018 - 07:16 PM

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View PostPrenzlau, on 10 April 2018 - 07:05 PM, said:

 

I have to admit! That is the most creative and original post I have ever seen in these forums! 

 

You really are the "Zen Master" I have been looking for!

 

Prenzlau

 

:teethhappy:

 

But back to this topic, I have the Ju 88A, and i've learned to just hit the big ground targets, and if i have to, fly at around 200-300 meters of the ground to just obliterate the ground targets in rapid succession and take the sector as quick as possible.

 

I will never forget the one time a bomb i dropped randomly landed on top of an Air defense craft, I laughed for three straight minutes.


Edited by NovaTempest, 10 April 2018 - 07:17 PM.


I_QQ_4_U #19 Posted 10 April 2018 - 09:02 PM

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View PostSpiritFoxMY, on 10 April 2018 - 02:55 PM, said:

 

Honestly, if you take a look at the planes in tiers 3 and 4, the altitude performance isn't as bad as people assume.

 

On paper maybe but when I play my Blenheim the majority of the time I don't even take a hit other than AA the whole game and I don't even go to those extreme altitudes the OP is talking about, usually below 3000m, and even at extreme altitudes I don't see accuracy being much of an issue as long as I fly straight and level and slow down just before I drop. I'd suspect I hit what I was aiming at 80 to 90% of the time and probably take it out in one drop 50 to 60% of the time. It's very rare I miss completely unless I make a low percentage drop as I'm turning.

SgtSchlautter #20 Posted 11 April 2018 - 12:04 AM

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View PostI_QQ_4_U, on 10 April 2018 - 09:02 PM, said:

 

On paper maybe but when I play my Blenheim the majority of the time I don't even take a hit other than AA the whole game and I don't even go to those extreme altitudes the OP is talking about, usually below 3000m, and even at extreme altitudes I don't see accuracy being much of an issue as long as I fly straight and level and slow down just before I drop. I'd suspect I hit what I was aiming at 80 to 90% of the time and probably take it out in one drop 50 to 60% of the time. It's very rare I miss completely unless I make a low percentage drop as I'm turning.

Exactly, rarely will u miss a target completely, even at those stupid altitudes. However, actually destroying the target in a single pass is where high altitude flying is hurting you. If u were flying lower, u would have a significantly higher impact in each battle






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