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xPALEHORSEx #61 Posted 18 April 2018 - 10:55 PM

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I would like to preface by saying I'm an admitted conspiracy theorist, and from time to time I allow it to get the best of me.

 

I see people here and on WoT talk about the game being stack, and sometimes rigged. I even saw one guy the other day say it was rigged against him.

 

 

That being said when people usually mention the word "stacked" they usually referring to unintentionally putting a much better team together on one side than the other.

 

Then you have people that say it is rigged, which I take to mean an intentional and malicious biased toward certain players. I really find that hard to fathom.

 

As a conspiracy theorist though I do have an idea. I don't think matches are stack against players, but a part of me does believe they are stacked against planes.

 

To believe in a good conspiracy, you have to ask yourself why.. Why would they do something like that? That is why I easily dismiss the idea of biased against players, what would they gain out of that. But when you think about planes a light bulb should go off in your head.

 

It is purely anecdotal (I'll admit) but the longer I play with a given plane, the worse I do in that plane. I have the P39, and haven't it but a week. My win % percentage in that plane is astronomically more than other planes I've had for a while. Shouldn't be the other way around. As I use a plane and build pilot skill and get used to it I should do better? But instead as I get time in the seat, obtain upgrades, and improve pilot skill I win less and less games.

 

I have to logically and sensibly ask the serious question "Do they nerf planes the longer you have them"?

 

Makes sense doesn't it? In a world where every slot in a match were fielded by a person that would be a significant task, but when more than half of your team is filled with bots it would be that hard to do.

 

Its not a concept that I would bet my life on but I must admit I seriously think about it from time to time.


Edited by xPALEHORSEx, 18 April 2018 - 10:56 PM.


daNEBish #62 Posted 19 April 2018 - 12:56 AM

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Block Quote

 xPALEHORSEx "As I use a plane and build pilot skill and get used to it I should do better?"

 

Not necessarily - What if you "think" you know how to play a certain aircraft but really you don't, and you're making the same mistakes over and over.  Doesn't matter how equipped your aircraft is or how many skills your pilot has - if you're playing badly then you're still going to do poorly.  Wargaming titles can be frustrating because it is not always obvious when your making a mistake, particularly in certain machines that maybe a bit tricky to learn.

 

I'm not saying necessarily that this is true in your case with the P39 - just food for thought.

 

There are many aircraft that I still just don't get, but I don't jump to conspiracy theories.  Instead I realize that just because I might be good in one type of aircraft, doesn't mean that I'm automatically going to dominate with others - this can even be true within the same type.  Eg.  Fighters could change as you go up the tiers and you may need to adjust your game play to fit.

 

I would suggest recording your own game play and reviewing them - particularly losses, it can be a very useful tool to finding mistakes and refining your play.  Watch and read guides from those that have more experience than you, chances are at some point they have gone through the same frustrations as you and have pulled some wisdom out of their struggles that you could take advantage of to reduce yours.

 

Block Quote

 xPALEHORSEx "I have to logically and sensibly ask the serious question "Do they nerf planes the longer you have them"?"

 

To believe in a good conspiracy, you have to ask yourself why.. Why would they do something like that?

 

Take a lesson from yourself here:  Why would Wargaming nerf planes the longer you have them?

 

It is in their interest to keep the game fun and keep players coming back for as long as possible.  Wargaming is a business, they are interested in money at the end of day.  All other aspects are there to keep repeat business coming back - can't do this without customers.  Simply put:  Engaged customers = Money!  Anything that would drive the majority of their customers away is not in Wargaming's interests.  That's my 2 cents on that conspiracy.

 

P.S. This does not mean that problems won't ever pop up, point is Wargaming won't deliberately leave hurtful aspects within their game.

 



xPALEHORSEx #63 Posted 19 April 2018 - 01:53 AM

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View PostdaNEBish, on 18 April 2018 - 06:56 PM, said:

 

Not necessarily - What if you "think" you know how to play a certain aircraft but really you don't, and you're making the same mistakes over and over.  Doesn't matter how equipped your aircraft is or how many skills your pilot has - if you're playing badly then you're still going to do poorly.  Wargaming titles can be frustrating because it is not always obvious when your making a mistake, particularly in certain machines that maybe a bit tricky to learn.

 

I'm not saying necessarily that this is true in your case with the P39 - just food for thought. 

 

There are many aircraft that I still just don't get, but I don't jump to conspiracy theories.  Instead I realize that just because I might be good in one type of aircraft, doesn't mean that I'm automatically going to dominate with others - this can even be true within the same type.  Eg.  Fighters could change as you go up the tiers and you may need to adjust your game play to fit.

 

I would suggest recording your own game play and reviewing them - particularly losses, it can be a very useful tool to finding mistakes and refining your play.  Watch and read guides from those that have more experience than you, chances are at some point they have gone through the same frustrations as you and have pulled some wisdom out of their struggles that you could take advantage of to reduce yours.

 

 

Take a lesson from yourself here:  Why would Wargaming nerf planes the longer you have them?

 

It is in their interest to keep the game fun and keep players coming back for as long as possible.  Wargaming is a business, they are interested in money at the end of day.  All other aspects are there to keep repeat business coming back - can't do this without customers.  Simply put:  Engaged customers = Money!  Anything that would drive the majority of their customers away is not in Wargaming's interests.  That's my 2 cents on that conspiracy.

 

P.S. This does not mean that problems won't ever pop up, point is Wargaming won't deliberately leave hurtful aspects within their game.

 

 

No offense and I appreciate the response but I think every point I made flew about 40 feet over your head.

 

My entire point in you first comment is that I DON"T do bad when I first get a new plane, and it isn't the point of how well I do personally anyway is much as it is my w/l. I never said nor alluded to the fact that I "think" I know how to fly a certain plane, you came to that conclusion without any input from me.

 

My KDR in the P39 is about 4 to 1 as of now, if you were to take out the day or two learning curve it would probably be 6 to 1. Not hall of fame stats, but not too bad with less than 500 total flights.

 

And to add to your point about me "thinking". It has absolutely nothing to do with me knowing or not knowing how to fly the plane. Regardless of where you start on the spectrum its a sliding scale. My winning % gets worse as I progress thru pilot skill and plan upgrades. Which most people would say (and I would love to hear a logical argument to the contrary) is illogical.

 

Again to address your second point it has nothing to do with what I get and don't get. I wish I could draw a line graph on here for you to see. Even if I don't get it, the line on the graph should at worst be horizontal, not get significantly worse as your plane gets significant upgrades.

 

Let me give you a real world example. If I have a Toyota Camey and I take it down to the 1/4 mile drag strip and I do the quarter in 19s, if someone gives me a Shelby Cobra you may can argue how much better I would do, but I damn sure shouldn't do any worse.

 

I really mean no disrespect to you but I think you jumped to several conclusions moreso than I jumped to conspiracy theories.

 

I record and catalog every game I play, and yes I do watch them, again its not so much my play as it is my win/losses.

 

As far as taking a lesson from myself, I probably should have explained the "why" but it is somewhat obvious. Would it not make sense to nerf planes the more they are played? It creates stagnancy and disrupts the flow of revenue for a business. And to be completely honest with you, I don't really have a problem with WG or any other game developer doing it. It would just be nice to know if they were.

 

Your last point is spot on, and goes right along with my previous point. It doesn't drive them away as much as it gives them a manufactured satisfaction when they do so much better with a new plane. And buying planes is definitely beneficial to the Developer.

 

Besides I never said I was sold on the conspiracy, I just said it was in the back of my mind.

 

Today for example, I have played approximately 10 games and I have won I think two. Both of those came in the P39 at different times during those 10 games. The rest of the time I came in 1st overall but lost.

SaveSaveSaveSave

Edited by xPALEHORSEx, 19 April 2018 - 01:56 AM.


xPALEHORSEx #64 Posted 19 April 2018 - 02:14 AM

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View PostdaNEBish, on 18 April 2018 - 06:56 PM, said:

 

Not necessarily - What if you "think" you know how to play a certain aircraft but really you don't, and you're making the same mistakes over and over.  Doesn't matter how equipped your aircraft is or how many skills your pilot has - if you're playing badly then you're still going to do poorly.  Wargaming titles can be frustrating because it is not always obvious when your making a mistake, particularly in certain machines that maybe a bit tricky to learn.

 

I'm not saying necessarily that this is true in your case with the P39 - just food for thought.

 

There are many aircraft that I still just don't get, but I don't jump to conspiracy theories.  Instead I realize that just because I might be good in one type of aircraft, doesn't mean that I'm automatically going to dominate with others - this can even be true within the same type.  Eg.  Fighters could change as you go up the tiers and you may need to adjust your game play to fit.

 

I would suggest recording your own game play and reviewing them - particularly losses, it can be a very useful tool to finding mistakes and refining your play.  Watch and read guides from those that have more experience than you, chances are at some point they have gone through the same frustrations as you and have pulled some wisdom out of their struggles that you could take advantage of to reduce yours.

 

 

Take a lesson from yourself here:  Why would Wargaming nerf planes the longer you have them?

 

It is in their interest to keep the game fun and keep players coming back for as long as possible.  Wargaming is a business, they are interested in money at the end of day.  All other aspects are there to keep repeat business coming back - can't do this without customers.  Simply put:  Engaged customers = Money!  Anything that would drive the majority of their customers away is not in Wargaming's interests.  That's my 2 cents on that conspiracy.

 

P.S. This does not mean that problems won't ever pop up, point is Wargaming won't deliberately leave hurtful aspects within their game.

 

 

For posterity here are few examples of what I'm talking about.

 

1048-3-30.jpg

 

1016-3-30.jpg

 

0155-3-30.jpg

 

0034_4-1.jpg

 

WoWP_13-1_1_LI 2.jpg

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trikke #65 Posted 19 April 2018 - 12:53 PM

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i've also experienced the seemingly ridiculously high-scoring first flight in a brand new plane several times now, with a score that was never repeated later

 

i do fully upgrade each plane before i fly it, and i often tweak skills and consumables after my first flights, but not enough to noticeably degrade performance 

 

surely we don't believe that WG coders would waste their time, nor would it even occur to them, to 'juice' the first flight of a player's brand new plane

 

because there's been so many other first flights that were such a disappointment

 

and really... what would be the point?

 

edit:   rereading the posts... i now see that we're talking about plane performance degrading over time, sorry


Edited by trikke, 19 April 2018 - 12:57 PM.

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Martymart1976 #66 Posted 19 April 2018 - 03:00 PM

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My WR goes up in a flight.  We split up at the start each going to a different cap.  Therefore, in the first minute of play we control 2 caps and are heading for a third cap together.

NovaTempest #67 Posted 19 April 2018 - 05:31 PM

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View PostxPALEHORSEx, on 19 April 2018 - 02:14 AM, said:

 

For posterity here are few examples of what I'm talking about.

 

1048-3-30.jpg

 

1016-3-30.jpg

 

0155-3-30.jpg

 

0034_4-1.jpg

 

WoWP_13-1_1_LI 2.jpg

SaveSave

 

Based on your five examples here (I might be wrong here but again, im going with what you have shown), i think your problem here is that, yes, you are taking down a good number of planes, but they are not over caps. The only time killing an enemy plane that isnt over a cap is significant is after the squall line rolls in, or if it is a GAA on its way to a cap your team is in control of, OR if it is an enemy bomber in an attack flight.

 

Out of all of the screenshots I have of post-battle results (most of which were of wins), only three of them cough up numbers of 'Destroyed while defending' like the ones you have shown here, the rest range from 5, to as high as 21 (Aka, virtually all of the kills I scored in the battle). Sometimes you have to be extremely aggressive or extremely defensive. In Three of my games where my team won, I accumulated over 500 capture points, of those, two of them i accumulated 600+.

 

Im not going to try to tell you what to do to fix what you might be doing wrong, but consider this diagnostic information based on what I am seeing. If you are really really really stuck still, I woudn't mind flighting with you at some point to maybe see whats going on.

 


Edited by NovaTempest, 19 April 2018 - 05:32 PM.


trikke #68 Posted 20 April 2018 - 12:49 PM

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View PostNovaTempest, on 19 April 2018 - 12:31 PM, said:

 

Based on your five examples here (I might be wrong here but again, im going with what you have shown), i think your problem here is that, yes, you are taking down a good number of planes, but they are not over caps. The only time killing an enemy plane that isnt over a cap is significant is after the squall line rolls in, or if it is a GAA on its way to a cap your team is in control of, OR if it is an enemy bomber in an attack flight.

 

Out of all of the screenshots I have of post-battle results (most of which were of wins), only three of them cough up numbers of 'Destroyed while defending' like the ones you have shown here, the rest range from 5, to as high as 21 (Aka, virtually all of the kills I scored in the battle). Sometimes you have to be extremely aggressive or extremely defensive. In Three of my games where my team won, I accumulated over 500 capture points, of those, two of them i accumulated 600+.

 

Im not going to try to tell you what to do to fix what you might be doing wrong, but consider this diagnostic information based on what I am seeing. If you are really really really stuck still, I woudn't mind flighting with you at some point to maybe see whats going on.

 

 

excellent constructive post from an excellent pilot

 

 

how many times have we seen threads like this degenerate into a "lern 2 play noob" dogpile, in other games...     i'm looking at you, WoT

 

personally, i'm proud to be a member of this forum


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Moonrider #69 Posted 20 April 2018 - 01:55 PM

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View Postchrishg, on 19 February 2018 - 10:09 PM, said:

At least in ver 1.XXX a single player could make a difference and turn the tide. Not anymore.  


Suckered by a necro. OOPS.

 


Edited by Moonrider, 20 April 2018 - 02:03 PM.

Anyone who cannot cope with mathematics is not fully human. At best he is a tolerable subhuman who has learned to wear shoes, bathe, and not make messes in the house.

SonicPariah #70 Posted 20 April 2018 - 04:41 PM

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View PostMoonrider, on 20 April 2018 - 01:55 PM, said:


Suckered by a necro. OOPS.

 

 

Happens to the best of us, unfortunately.




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