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The Four Things That Make Bombers Frustrating To Play In The Current Meta

balance AA HP Bombers

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Poll: Issues with Bombers (49 members have cast votes)

High-Altitude AA: OP, UP, or Just Right?

  1. OP (18 votes [36.73%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 36.73%

  2. UP (5 votes [10.20%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 10.20%

  3. Just Right (23 votes [46.94%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 46.94%

  4. I don't know (3 votes [6.12%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 6.12%

Should information about the exact altitude that your engines struggle to keep above stall speed in anything but a perfectly flat, straight line be added?

  1. Yes (28 votes [57.14%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 57.14%

  2. No (17 votes [34.69%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 34.69%

  3. I don't know (3 votes [6.12%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 6.12%

  4. I don't understand(ask me if you don't understand this, it is in fact kind of complicated) (1 vote [2.04%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 2.04%

Should Bomber optimum altitude increase?(thus Bombers can travel a bit faster at a high altitude, where they are generally mostly safe)

  1. yes (19 votes [38.78%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 38.78%

  2. no (28 votes [57.14%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 57.14%

  3. I don't know (2 votes [4.08%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 4.08%

Should the skills Weakest Link,(gunner automatically aims for the enemy lowest on health, not worth it's extremely high price) Defensive Fire(doesn't seem to work right) be buffed or removed?

  1. yes (28 votes [57.14%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 57.14%

  2. no (12 votes [24.49%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 24.49%

  3. I don't know (9 votes [18.37%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 18.37%

Do you use Concealing Liverly on your Bombers?

  1. Yes (29 votes [59.18%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 59.18%

  2. No (20 votes [40.82%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 40.82%

  3. I don't know (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  4. I don't have any Bombers yet (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

If you answered yes to the last question, do you find it to have a noticeable, major effect?

  1. yes (19 votes [38.78%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 38.78%

  2. no (12 votes [24.49%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 24.49%

  3. I don't know (3 votes [6.12%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 6.12%

  4. I did not answer yes to the last question (15 votes [30.61%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 30.61%

Cruise Flight: do you use this skill on any planes you own?

  1. yes (14 votes [28.57%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 28.57%

  2. no (33 votes [67.35%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 67.35%

  3. I don't know (2 votes [4.08%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 4.08%

If you answered yes to the last question, does Cruise Flight have a noticeable effect/seem to be working correctly?

  1. yes (13 votes [26.53%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 26.53%

  2. no (3 votes [6.12%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 6.12%

  3. I don't know (3 votes [6.12%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 6.12%

  4. I did not answer yes to the last question (30 votes [61.22%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 61.22%

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legoboy0401 #1 Posted 23 January 2018 - 01:33 AM

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Lately I've been noticing some very severe problems with Bombers. I'll still play them anyway(I like them too much), but here is my list of things that make playing Bombers in the current meta kind of suck.

 

1.         When it comes to balance in WoWP 2.0, nothing could be further from that word than High-altitude AA. It is SUPER strong, and guess what?

 

Concealing Livery, even when boosted with the pilot skill, seems to do virtually nothing to screw up its aim. The main problem with High-altitude AA is that you have to maneuver to dodge it, and you can't do that in a Bomber unless you want to screw up your bombing run.

 

High-Altitude AA is ridiculous and makes playing a bomber a real pain. Worse yet, it's REALLY HARD to get to a range that high-altitude AA can't reach, in fact, I  highly suspect that currently, the RB-17 is the only one actually capable of doing so.

 

2.           I would really like for there to be, if not in the HUD, at least in the hangar a detail that pinpoints the exact altitude in which a plane's engines start to struggle to keep the plane above stall speed without boost.

 

This has frustrated me so much. I get to the altitude I want to be at, switch to bombsight mode, get almost over a target, slow down just a little to ensure accuracy, and get a big huge stall warning, forcing me to boost just to keep altitude.           

 

At times, even at 2,700 meters in the Ju-88A, FAR below the red zone for the Ju-88A,(let alone the actual ceiling) I get frequent stall warnings in the shallowest of climbs. This just makes me want to scream, it makes so little sense and hinders my mobility in getting from one cap to another.

 

3.      Bomber "optimum altitude" sucks, forcing them to have to go really low to have a chance(to be fast enough, in other words) at making it to enough caps to have a chance of getting Bomber IV-class or higher

 

4.      A couple of ancient skills for pilots and gunners that have no business sticking around after 2.0, and it's just silly that they remain. I would love for there to be new skills in their place, that have more relevance.

 

5.     Skills like Cruise Flight and Defensive Fire don't seem to do practically anything, even though they should. The latter probably only applies to ACTUAL enemy planes,(it was programmed before 2.0 came around, so it probably doesn't recognize air defense planes), and the former just seems lame and a total waste.

 

Also, does anyone run Cruise Flight or Concealing Livery on your Bombers? If so, do they seem to do anything much for your plane?

 

Thanks in advance!


Edited by legoboy0401, 23 January 2018 - 02:11 AM.

An average player with an average goal: greatness, someday. Today, mediocrity will have to suffice. But no matter, I will always play to the best of my ability, and I will always strive to make the best of my ability just that little bit stronger and better.

 

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SpiritFoxMY #2 Posted 23 January 2018 - 01:57 AM

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1. Agreed. Not just bombers, fighters too. I've taken stupid amounts of damage from flak fighting for a cap. I've lost games several times because the flak chose me instead of my target. And nothing infuriates me more than finally getting the better of a tough human opponent only to be nuked by a lucky flak burst.

 

2. I agree on the stats (I hate hidden stats in genetal) but I've never had the issue of stalling during a bomb run. I always make sure I level the bubble before sighting for a run.

 

3. No. Bombers are frustrating enough to deal with as is, especially if you're in a low-flier and only have bots in the bomber-interceptors. My opinion may change with more humans but as is, a human in a bomber can kill bot fighters with alarming ease.

 

4. Don't have them I would have hoped Defensive Fire worked - I'm counting on that to defend my tier X batplane...

 

5. Again don't have them so cannot comment. I think the Active Skills are underpowered overall. I tried Concealing Livery on the Blenheim didn't do enough. I got reinforced airframe instead: helps with flak and fighters. Win-win!


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mnbv_fockewulfe #3 Posted 23 January 2018 - 02:08 AM

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Can confirm.

Cruise flight helps noticeable when stacking only for speed.

Fw 190 max speed in level flight stock (no skills/equipment) 660km/h.


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legoboy0401 #4 Posted 23 January 2018 - 02:10 AM

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View PostSpiritFoxMY, on 22 January 2018 - 05:57 PM, said:

1. Agreed. Not just bombers, fighters too. I've taken stupid amounts of damage from flak fighting for a cap. I've lost games several times because the flak chose me instead of my target. And nothing infuriates me more than finally getting the better of a tough human opponent only to be nuked by a lucky flak burst.

 

2. I agree on the stats (I hate hidden stats in genetal) but I've never had the issue of stalling during a bomb run. I always make sure I level the bubble before sighting for a run.

 

3. No. Bombers are frustrating enough to deal with as is, especially if you're in a low-flier and only have bots in the bomber-interceptors. My opinion may change with more humans but as is, a human in a bomber can kill bot fighters with alarming ease.

 

4. Don't have them I would have hoped Defensive Fire worked - I'm counting on that to defend my tier X batplane...

 

5. Again don't have them so cannot comment. I think the Active Skills are underpowered overall. I tried Concealing Livery on the Blenheim didn't do enough. I got reinforced airframe instead: helps with flak and fighters. Win-win!

 

As for number 3, the ceiling wouldn't change at all, only the optimal altitude, so Bombers could retain speed a little better at altitude. Besides, have you played German Bombers? They are stupid fragile. Anything that could help keep them from having to descend is good.

An average player with an average goal: greatness, someday. Today, mediocrity will have to suffice. But no matter, I will always play to the best of my ability, and I will always strive to make the best of my ability just that little bit stronger and better.

 

#Failureisalwaysanoption

 

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legoboy0401 #5 Posted 23 January 2018 - 02:13 AM

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View Postmnbv_fockewulfe, on 22 January 2018 - 06:08 PM, said:

Can confirm.

Cruise flight helps noticeable when stacking only for speed.

Fw 190 max speed in level flight stock (no skills/equipment) 660km/h.

 

Good. It's nice to know that works. It's crappy on bombers though. What about Resilience or Battle-Tested? Do those work properly?


An average player with an average goal: greatness, someday. Today, mediocrity will have to suffice. But no matter, I will always play to the best of my ability, and I will always strive to make the best of my ability just that little bit stronger and better.

 

#Failureisalwaysanoption

 

#Givingupneveris


LMG #6 Posted 23 January 2018 - 02:13 AM

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As far as I'm aware, Concealing Livery reduces the damage you take by 30% from AA fire, not the AA's accuracy. One of my problems with Bombers is that they seem to require 4 slots for equipment instead of 3. I want to run Concealing Livery, Bombsight, Reinforced Airframe and rear-gun stabilization, but sadly I have to throw one away. So I get to choose whether I get chewed up by AA, miss half of my bombs, can't survive one pass from a heavy or can't deal with enemy fighters from a safe distance :(. On GAAs at least you can skip the Concealing Livery since you can deal with the AA efficiently via gunfire, but Bombers have no way to fight them aside of wasting bombs and time on the AA guns or tanking damage


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SpiritFoxMY #7 Posted 23 January 2018 - 02:18 AM

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View Postlegoboy0401, on 23 January 2018 - 02:10 AM, said:

 

As for number 3, the ceiling wouldn't change at all, only the optimal altitude, so Bombers could retain speed a little better at altitude. Besides, have you played German Bombers? They are stupid fragile. Anything that could help keep them from having to descend is good.

 

I've played them. I have a post on Magus' Ju88A thread to that effect regarding a pair of bomber-hunters. But that experience has thus far been the exception rather than the rule. I have only encountered fighters five or six times. I got murdered twice, mutually destroyed each other once and shot down the rest (one by ramming).

 

Admittedly for about a third of my games I've had a pocket escort fighter who helps swat down anyone trying to climb up to me.


***

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mnbv_fockewulfe #8 Posted 23 January 2018 - 02:18 AM

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View Postlegoboy0401, on 23 January 2018 - 02:13 AM, said:

 

Good. It's nice to know that works. It's crappy on bombers though. What about Resilience or Battle-Tested? Do those work properly?

 

I've gotten 851km/h in level flight in my Ta 152 (although without cruise flight).:kamikaze:

I can't say anything about the other pilot skill as I always relied on my speed and guns to keep me safe.

scratch that, I got faster. Mach 1.:B

QfPE69i.jpg


 

and you thought the RB-17's TG was OP

Spoiler


 


Edited by mnbv_fockewulfe, 23 January 2018 - 02:27 AM.

Be sure to check your logic privileges before posting on the forum.

 


 


Pogo68 #9 Posted 23 January 2018 - 02:30 AM

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Is anyone else running into an issue with the A-26B a low altitude where it seems to have a hard time maintaining speed?

When I say low I mean below 100m low.

 

Coming in from I dive, with the throttle at firewalled I find that the speed dropping down to stall speed.

And I have to hit the boost and climb up to above 200m just to stay in the air.

 


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    1. Try to secure the upper hand before attacking.
    2. Always continue with an attack you have begun
    3. Open fire only at close range, and then only when the opponent is squarely in your sights
    4. You should always try to keep your eye on your opponent, and never let yourself be deceived by ruses
    5. In any type of attack, it is essential to assail your opponent from behind
    6. If your opponent dives on you, do not try run away from his attack, but fly to meet it
    7. When over the enemy's lines, always remember your own line of retreat
    8. It is better to attack in groups of four or six. Avoid two aircraft attacking the same opponent

Moggytwo #10 Posted 23 January 2018 - 06:39 AM

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Just fly your bombers at low level, it's both extremely fun and very effective.  This solves all the problems you listed, but only works T5 and above atm.

hoom #11 Posted 23 January 2018 - 08:10 AM

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Possibly issues particular to Ju-88A?

 

1: Blenheim IV mostly gets above the AA easily enough, 2750m is enough for most, though there are a few cap points who will still be shooting you over 3100m.

Interestingly I've been using the A-26B at ~1500m recently and taking surprisingly little AA damage, possibly due to better speed/manoeuvrability?

 

I think WG has set up some of the caps to be near impossible to bomb (possibly based on current cap balance?)

Definitely there is a difference in high-altitude AA strength depending on what type & the strongest ones have lots, if you can't get above you best go elsewhere.

The lighter armed ones you can kill the AA on first pass or two -> significantly limit the amount of damage you take. Alternatively a quick cap flip will limit AA damage taken, particularly on a partially capped point you go in & dump bombs on biggest points to give max cap flip ability.

 

2: Its important to keep several secs of Boost available for when you switch to Bombsight.

It takes a couple of seconds for the autopilot to flatten the plane off, if you're out of boost you'll be slowing & may stall, even if you don't it'll take a long time to get back up to a reasonable level flight speed.

 

I have both Engine Guru & Engine Tuning on both my Blenheim IV & A-26B which presumably helps with that.

 

3: I think Ju-88A has a relatively low Optimum vs other Bombers?

Most maps I haven't had too much issue with transition speed, possibly because I mostly try to fly as low as I can but still be safe, the bigger maps I may drop altitude to increase my transition speed, gain height again before reaching the cap.

Early battle if you spent your Boost climbing and first cap flips quick that can be more of an issue but once you spend some time hovering over a cap you generally build up a nice Boost buffer to spend on transitioning.

 

Again the Engine Guru + Engine Tuning combo likely help here.

 

4/5: Definitely some oddities which don't seem very useful.

The burst length gunner skill in particular doesn't seem much point since tail gunners shoot continuously (or WG needs to better describe its advantage), but you need it for the extended range skill.

 

I used Cruise Flight on La-7 for a while & it definitely was noticeable when it kicked in, not tried on any Bombers though. Kinda thinking about it now but I don't really have spare Skill points.

Used Concealing Livery on Blenheim IV for quite a while, took it off when it was pointed out that its not contributing anything most of the time since I fly above AA most of the time, haven't felt any rush to put it back on.


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SpiritFoxMY #12 Posted 23 January 2018 - 01:17 PM

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I don't get the 88A hate. I think its a decent little bomber. Maybe that comes from having played it the most, but I liked the 88A. Most of my fighter kills are in this plane too including salty mcsaltypants who took to raging at me for daring to shoot him down while he was idly sitting at 600m off my tail spraying .50 cal that only hits at 500m

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ExploratorOne #13 Posted 23 January 2018 - 04:31 PM

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View PostMoggytwo, on 23 January 2018 - 01:39 AM, said:

Just fly your bombers at low level, it's both extremely fun and very effective.  This solves all the problems you listed, but only works T5 and above atm.

 

The Blenheim IV at T3 works very well at 50m-100m.  My bombs are reloaded by the time I turn around after a pass.  I prefer to run all of my bombers low level and only go high when there are enemy human pilots that know what they are doing and interfere with my low level plans.

Mercsn #14 Posted 23 January 2018 - 04:31 PM

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Man, I hate to say this, because I hate being a dbag, but....learn how it all works.

 

First, "AA" is low altitude.  "Flak" is high altitude.  These are the words and definitions as used by WG to denote the two distinct types of anti-aircraft fire.  

 

If you don't like taking Flak damage....uh...man I'm going to sound like a dbag again, but here goes:  bomb them.  If you bomb them, they stop shooting at you. Flak is the triangle with square base icon.

 

After reading a reply, hoom's I think, if you're having trouble with the massive amounts of flak at factories, attack them at low altitude.  Factories have zero AA, just Flak. 

 

Concealing livery doesn't throw off anti-aircraft aim, it just reduces damage. 

 

Your engines struggle to fly level when you hit the red zone.  This is true for every plane. Altimeter scroll can be enabled in ui so you can more easily see the red zone approaching.  But, just climb to max alt in a training room if you want to see what that altitude is for a given plane. Then remember it. It doesn't change. Altitude is now only displayed as above sea level, so terrain is irrelevant. 

 

Bomber optimum altitude should probably be lowered.  As it is, many HF cannot even reach a player bomber. 

 

The gunnery skills do not need point adjustment.  Take range and crit first.  If the enemy is nearly dead, finish them off yourself.  The TG has 100 aim assist, guaranteed hit, when fired by the player. You can choose your target.

 

Cruise flight icon shows that it works.  I had it on my Russian La line pilot for a while and it was noticeable in the Yak-3RD.  If you take any damage or deal any damage, the effect ends.  Also, if your bomber isn't fast, your boosting speed as a %. So 3% of slow is...less slow, but still slow, especially if you are at, and stay at, max altitude where you are even slower.  Because then it's a 3% increase of really slow.  

If you already have bombardier, defense skill, and reduced fire damage skill, then maybe spend the points on cruise flight if you want to move from zone to zone faster.  But, ifanything lands a shot on you, the effect turns off until you receive no damage for another 20 seconds.

 

Instead of goofy polls, I'd like to see you just ask how to do something better or how to cope with issues for a class, such as bomber.

 

Bombers aren't going to be impervious to attack. But, right now, they are really well defended by altitude and crazy gunner range. Both of which need to be reduced, not buffed, for balance.  Try the gunner range and crit skill and manually fire it. I'll call you a lier if you say that combo isn't OP

 

 


Edited by Mercsn, 23 January 2018 - 04:52 PM.

All the Important Thread Links (go here for answers!) Might be outdated!

All-in-one thread with 2.0 related guide links.

 

The below was said to me (Mercsn), from a concerned player:

Edited, on 12 March - 2:01PM , said:

and PS...play more, forum less.  Your opinion might be more credible.

Mercsn #15 Posted 23 January 2018 - 04:36 PM

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View Postlegoboy0401, on 22 January 2018 - 08:10 PM, said:

 

As for number 3, the ceiling wouldn't change at all, only the optimal altitude, so Bombers could retain speed a little better at altitude. Besides, have you played German Bombers? They are stupid fragile. Anything that could help keep them from having to descend is good.

 

the way it's set up, changing the optimum altitude (when you hit yellow) changes the max altitude (when you hit red).  My guess is that max is derived from optimum in the code and not actually a separate stat. You're not getting anything that requires a code change. 

All the Important Thread Links (go here for answers!) Might be outdated!

All-in-one thread with 2.0 related guide links.

 

The below was said to me (Mercsn), from a concerned player:

Edited, on 12 March - 2:01PM , said:

and PS...play more, forum less.  Your opinion might be more credible.

legoboy0401 #16 Posted 23 January 2018 - 06:00 PM

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View PostMercsn, on 23 January 2018 - 08:31 AM, said:

Man, I hate to say this, because I hate being a dbag, but....learn how it all works.

 

First, "AA" is low altitude.  "Flak" is high altitude.  These are the words and definitions as used by WG to denote the two distinct types of anti-aircraft fire.  

 

If you don't like taking Flak damage....uh...man I'm going to sound like a dbag again, but here goes:  bomb them.  If you bomb them, they stop shooting at you. Flak is the triangle with square base icon.

 

After reading a reply, hoom's I think, if you're having trouble with the massive amounts of flak at factories, attack them at low altitude.  Factories have zero AA, just Flak. 

 

Concealing livery doesn't throw off anti-aircraft aim, it just reduces damage. 

 

Your engines struggle to fly level when you hit the red zone.  This is true for every plane. Altimeter scroll can be enabled in ui so you can more easily see the red zone approaching.  But, just climb to max alt in a training room if you want to see what that altitude is for a given plane. Then remember it. It doesn't change. Altitude is now only displayed as above sea level, so terrain is irrelevant. 

 

Bomber optimum altitude should probably be lowered.  As it is, many HF cannot even reach a player bomber. 

 

The gunnery skills do not need point adjustment.  Take range and crit first.  If the enemy is nearly dead, finish them off yourself.  The TG has 100 aim assist, guaranteed hit, when fired by the player. You can choose your target.

 

Cruise flight icon shows that it works.  I had it on my Russian La line pilot for a while and it was noticeable in the Yak-3RD.  If you take any damage or deal any damage, the effect ends.  Also, if your bomber isn't fast, your boosting speed as a %. So 3% of slow is...less slow, but still slow, especially if you are at, and stay at, max altitude where you are even slower.  Because then it's a 3% increase of really slow.  

If you already have bombardier, defense skill, and reduced fire damage skill, then maybe spend the points on cruise flight if you want to move from zone to zone faster.  But, ifanything lands a shot on you, the effect turns off until you receive no damage for another 20 seconds.

 

Instead of goofy polls, I'd like to see you just ask how to do something better or how to cope with issues for a class, such as bomber.

 

Bombers aren't going to be impervious to attack. But, right now, they are really well defended by altitude and crazy gunner range. Both of which need to be reduced, not buffed, for balance.  Try the gunner range and crit skill and manually fire it. I'll call you a lier if you say that combo isn't OP

 

 

 

 Mercn, you do know you are generally a jerk to everyone you meet, right? With that in mind,consider yourself lucky I even responded to you this time. 

 

First of all, I bomb anything and everything, because I bomb any and all sectors I can get my hands on(because irritating 3-zone maps still exist, as does hideously OP and awful Superiority, which limits time spent in a battle:sceptic:) I hate to tell you this, but it's usually a waste of my time to bomb Flak. I will do it when there is nothing else to bomb, but I hate doing it in an effort to slow the effects of AA, because they respawn the quickest of any ground target, and within about 90, 100 seconds they are back up again and shooting at me. Trying to keep them dead is like a game of Whack-A-Mole. No matter how many times or how fast you hit them, they just keep coming back up. I hate wasting my bombs on them as it takes EXTREME precision, the likes of which even Flak guns themselves can mess up. This is why most people ignore AA and concentrate on the targets that give the most points.

 

2. Factories don't exist in WoWP, as you said to me, LEARN THE FREAKING TERMS MAN! As for Mining Plants, hoom is wrong. I ALWAYS attack Mining Plants at low(sub-2000 meters) altitude when possible. Unfortunately, when it's contested by the enemy team and they have a couple of Heavy Fighters around, I have to make a beeline for 2,900-3,000 meters again, maybe even higher.

 

3. As for Concealing Livery, its effects are piddly at best, and downright deserving of throwing it away at worst. Even the skill only marginally helps boost it.

 

4. Clearly, you don't know what I'm talking about. In my Ju-88A(with a max altitude of 3,800 meters) I seem to mysteriously have problems with anything other than a perfectly flat, straight line without boost at an altitude where I should be pretty good, 2,800 meters. No, if I were having problems in higher(which I have before, 3,300 meters) altitudes I'd generally have problems with keeping above stall speed even in a perfectly flat straight line.(which I have before)

 

5. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA - my actual reaction to reading your fifth point.

 

I get it, you are just mad you went down the wrong line and your Beaufighter doesn't have the altitude to reach your average player bomber, unlike the BF-110s. Dude, grind the German Heavy Fighter Line or LEARN TO PLAY THE BEAUFIGHTER IN THE CORRECT MANNER! What you said is totally not true. The Germans can, the U.S. can, heck, only the Se-100 and the British Heavy Fighters(never were the best anyway, as the Tier X Javelin is a major departure from the rest of the line) can't do it. If you want to catch bombers, you need the right aircraft. With that said, lines like the BF-109 line,(though the Tier VI and VII suck, and I'm going down that line myself) and the MiG line(the Tier VI and VIII suck, but the rest of the line is all right and the MiG-15Bis is worth it, I've heard)can also do it, in a pinch.

 

L2P, dude, enough said.

 

 

6. Yet again, you set up a strawman. That's not what I was talking about, and I have a feeling you deliberately chose to attack a point that wasn't mine, so you could defeat it more easily. I have a point, and you don't want to admit it. I was actually talking about such useless skills as Weakest Link(which no one ever uses anymore) and Defensive Fire(which seems too weak for it's price). The former should ideally be removed, and the latter should get a looking over. That's all.

 

 

7. Did you even read my poll and post? I think not. The question was not "does Cruise Flight work?" but "are the Cruise Flight bonuses being applied correctly when it is on?" I already have proof that it does, and that it's an okay skill but not really all that useful for a bomber, so 'mic drop'

 

8. What do you mean? This was set up to ask questions, give opinions, and have a general back and forth. I think you are trying to lord over me with how many battles you played before 2.0. Dude, this is a new game, and I'm actually a pretty good player. I'm not perfect, but neither are you, and you are fooling yourself if you think you are.

 

9. Altitude, yes, although sometimes I have to give that altitude up. Crazy range? Blame that on shortsighted devs giving the RussianBias-17 too much range to begin with. Most Bombers do not have such insane gun range, including the new German Bombers. If other bombers do, it's because they have REALLY SKILLED GUNNERS with around 10 points, that's why, and also have chosen to give up a module(probably Concealing Livery) to put in Turret Stabilization in it's place. Given, a combination of range and critical hits IS most certainly OP, but for now, it's not a problem on anything but a RB-17 or occasional A-26B. The new German Bombers and the Blenheim IV(e) haven't had enough time to get all 3 skills necessary(as it requires an 8 point gunner, at least)

 

In the end dude, if I were you and you were a judge, I'd recuse myself from talking about Bombers. You clearly have a side, and will stay there. I understand the frustrations of both sides, as I've been there in the bomber and in the interceptor, but I feel the advantage, at least for now, is still in the hands of a good interceptor pilot.

 

Don't feel too bad, though, as I know what it's like to tell other players who want help"L2P, noob!" I've been there before. I feel bad about it, though, and I wish I would have been more helpful to them, instead of just screaming at them as I did.(yes, I did use L2P in this post, but you really do need to learn the strengths of the British Heavies.)


Edited by legoboy0401, 23 January 2018 - 06:02 PM.

An average player with an average goal: greatness, someday. Today, mediocrity will have to suffice. But no matter, I will always play to the best of my ability, and I will always strive to make the best of my ability just that little bit stronger and better.

 

#Failureisalwaysanoption

 

#Givingupneveris


legoboy0401 #17 Posted 23 January 2018 - 06:07 PM

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View PostMercsn, on 23 January 2018 - 08:36 AM, said:

 

the way it's set up, changing the optimum altitude (when you hit yellow) changes the max altitude (when you hit red).  My guess is that max is derived from optimum in the code and not actually a separate stat. You're not getting anything that requires a code change. 

 

I think it needs to be updated. I think it's a vestige from 1.9-(which it probably is)

 

Also, I was not trying to be necessarily rude or anything in the last post, but I am kind of angry how you just called me an idiot and a liar, not to mention a good-for-nothing noob.


An average player with an average goal: greatness, someday. Today, mediocrity will have to suffice. But no matter, I will always play to the best of my ability, and I will always strive to make the best of my ability just that little bit stronger and better.

 

#Failureisalwaysanoption

 

#Givingupneveris


nwlxn12 #18 Posted 23 January 2018 - 06:35 PM

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Damage from AA across the board seems in line, so if they reduce the high altitude stuff, they will also need to adjust the low altitude stuff to keep it in line.  If you compare how much %HP a low flyer looses to AA to what a bomber looses, they are about even for the amount of time they are in it (using zones that have both high and low altitude AA), even though bombers can get to an altitude where they pretty much only worry about the flak and don't have to worry about fighters.  For most zones, I feel bombers have an easier time of flipping them, so as far as balance is concerned, you have to take it all into account, not just how much damage is being done to the plane.

 

Any changes to altitude indicators or performance should be made across the board to all planes if done, unless WG determines there is a balance issue.  Right now I think the bomber alt is OK since a lot of planes can't get to them.

 

Weakest link is good for those planes that have a tail gunner but circumstances don't always allow you to control them (ie: maneuvering).

 

Just my 2 cents, if WG thinks that the bomber parameters are set up correctly, any changes would need to be balanced across the board with all the other planes.  I play them least of all, but I don't think they are out of line.

 



legoboy0401 #19 Posted 23 January 2018 - 06:43 PM

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View Postnwlxn12, on 23 January 2018 - 10:35 AM, said:

Damage from AA across the board seems in line, so if they reduce the high altitude stuff, they will also need to adjust the low altitude stuff to keep it in line.  If you compare how much %HP a low flyer looses to AA to what a bomber looses, they are about even for the amount of time they are in it (using zones that have both high and low altitude AA), even though bombers can get to an altitude where they pretty much only worry about the flak and don't have to worry about fighters.  For most zones, I feel bombers have an easier time of flipping them, so as far as balance is concerned, you have to take it all into account, not just how much damage is being done to the plane.

 

Any changes to altitude indicators or performance should be made across the board to all planes if done, unless WG determines there is a balance issue.  Right now I think the bomber alt is OK since a lot of planes can't get to them.

 

Weakest link is good for those planes that have a tail gunner but circumstances don't always allow you to control them (ie: maneuvering).

 

Just my 2 cents, if WG thinks that the bomber parameters are set up correctly, any changes would need to be balanced across the board with all the other planes.  I play them least of all, but I don't think they are out of line.

 

 

No one uses Weakest Link. It's been said before that not only is it not very helpful, it's EXTREMELY overpriced for such a small change. In the past, there was a reason it was so expensive: you couldn't manually control the tail gunner, thus whatever target he picked is the one he was stuck shooting at. But now, since you CAN manually control the tail gunner, there's practically no benefit now because you yourself can do the same job Weakest Link did long ago.

An average player with an average goal: greatness, someday. Today, mediocrity will have to suffice. But no matter, I will always play to the best of my ability, and I will always strive to make the best of my ability just that little bit stronger and better.

 

#Failureisalwaysanoption

 

#Givingupneveris


CorvusCorvax #20 Posted 23 January 2018 - 07:46 PM

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View Postlegoboy0401, on 23 January 2018 - 06:00 PM, said:

 

 I understand the frustrations of both sides, as I've been there in the bomber and in the interceptor, but I feel the advantage, at least for now, is still in the hands of a good interceptor pilot.

 

 

Even a crap interceptor pilot.  I mean, it is no work at all to climb up with a Bf-110 and swat bombers out of the sky.  I enjoy it when I pick the -110 and its a map with a command center.  I can just wait outside the defended zone for the bombers to come, then shoot down all five before they reach the middle of the map.  Individual bot or human bombers are hardly more of a challenge.  Even if they have low cover.

 

Have you ever noticed that when someone types "not to be a d-bag, but..." they go right on to be a d-bag?  Unrelated question - is there a function within the forum software to block users?  Asking for a friend.







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