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ME 262 failed expectations


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Mercsn #41 Posted 02 January 2018 - 12:06 PM

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View PostBobby_Tables, on 02 January 2018 - 01:01 AM, said:

 

Dude, seriously, you could write up an instruction manual for WOWP newbies, post it on Amazon and charge like $.99 (no offense, but hey, who's going to pay more than that).  

 

That way, your forum posts could be less verbose as you could just point people to your Amazon book link.  

 

At maybe 2000 total NA players tops, if about 5% of the players bought your book it would bring in roughly $100 (less Amazon fees).  You could then use that money to buy gold or other goodies and then think about Episode 2.   With translation to other languages, you could possibly bring in upwards of $500.  

 

Just a thought....  Good write-ups by the way, just try to use less words.   

 

Doh!  I'm terrible at boiling things down into concise snippets.  It's just difficult to take a concept that will require some thought on the reader's part to implement and boil that down into something that doesn't require thoughtful digestion as they read it.

 

From what I understand, the few who can manage that are rewarded.  I'm ok with the twitter-babies not being rewarded with knowledge if they can't get through the post.  I'd rather my words were more helpful to a deserving few than be less helpful to everyone.

 

I've thought about making vids, especially to visually explain the game mode, but they'd run longer than YouTube's 15 sec average view time and the effort required to edit a vid is way more than editing a post. And, yeah, what ends up posted jn the forums was my version of "edited for brevity and clarity".  Doh!

:ohmy:


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Edited, on 12 March - 2:01PM , said:

and PS...play more, forum less.  Your opinion might be more credible.

pyantoryng #42 Posted 02 January 2018 - 12:18 PM

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View PostMercsn, on 02 January 2018 - 12:06 PM, said:

 

Doh!  I'm terrible at boiling things down into concise snippets.  It's just difficult to take a concept that will require some thought on the reader's part to implement and boil that down into something that doesn't require thoughtful digestion as they read it.

 

From what I understand, the few who can manage that are rewarded.  I'm ok with the twitter-babies not being rewarded with knowledge if they can't get through the post.  I'd rather my words were more helpful to a deserving few than be less helpful to everyone.

 

I've thought about making vids, especially to visually explain the game mode, but they'd run longer than YouTube's 15 sec average view time and the effort required to edit a vid is way more than editing a post. And, yeah, what ends up posted jn the forums was my version of "edited for brevity and clarity".  Doh!

:ohmy:

 

You only need Notepad to write...you need those go-go software gadgets to edit video... and the more decent ones cost dollars...:unsure:

 

I can sympathize with you there, though. I'm crap at being concise too. But alas, flying is something alien to a lot of people, and it will take a lot more time to sink in than driving or sailing...the paradigm shift to high tier seem more drastic than the other two titles, too...



WoWP makes a great jousting game...especially with the 262 and people busy in furballs...
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CamuMahubah #43 Posted 02 January 2018 - 01:21 PM

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View PostMercsn, on 02 January 2018 - 11:55 AM, said:

 

We'll just disagree on this then.  The place to learn energy fighting, target priority and shooting from speed is in lower tier with a plane that aims with nose mounted guns. There's a bigger difference in shooting feel between spread out wing guns and nose guns, regardless of caliber. The 30mm shoot different than the 20mm, but it's just a matter of learning the new lead distance.  

 

The zed doesn’t shoot the same as the 262. Even if you pick the correct aim point, a target can fly through the spread out rounds of the zed.  With the 262, the shots are more closely grouped and will reward good aim point prediction by hitting the enemy.  The enemy won't be able to "accidentally" dodge the 262's the way he can with the zed's dispersed shots.

 

And, at 250 battles, tier 7 also isn't a friendly learning tier, the OP hasn't done enough of this style of play to not be overwhelmed by the speed of events while still having opportunity to focus on what he should be doing.  

 

Those tier 4 and 5 planes you recommend also have maquinas.  Yah so great they also have nose mounted cannon but you do not fly the 262 like you fly 110.  

 

In 110 you fire for loooooooong time before gun get red.

 

In 262 you fire shrt time gun red.

 

In 110 you can tank around a cap at all altitudes.(Maybe you shouldn't but you can easy and it's a bad habit the plane will let you get away with.)

 

In 262 you stay high and energy fighting through the cap.

 

If you wanna learn Me 262 you are gonna fail with it at first.  It's taking me some time to learn it and I know I can't jump in my tier 4/5 German Heavy and get the same feeling. 

 

They are not fast enough.  P-38 sorta feels like similar play but it has the neverending .50's.

 

I am sorta figuring out 262 and I like it more each sortie but I am still missing many leading shots because I overestimate or underestimate Kentucky windage.

 

Keeping speed and making those 30's do work is a challenge and it should be.  If it hit as easily as tier 4 German Heavy guns it would OP af.

 

Lately when I fly Me 262 I have had bad luck in that the red team has had tier 9 GA' flown by semi-competent mammals.  A mammal in a GA is my nemesis because I'm too dumb to realize they can shoot forward too.  And they can shoot really good backwards.  And I don't wanna be that low in Me 262 but when cro magnons are in such airborne tanks I sometimes have to take them out because they flip caps like acrobats on Ritalin.

 

Maybe go fly Lightening plane is better recommendation.  At least it does give that Zoom and Boom feeling of..."oh snap I can't kill enough in one pass and I've gotta zoom back and stay fast and high ..and zomg this cannon cain't hit a stripe on a zebra...omg I'll get one dive on that GA before he flips iT...".

 

Mercsn is smart guy.  Maybe I just think differently and see world different.  I do know Me 262 is a spiteful mistress who will let you die if you mess up but if you hold the reins just right she will murder all that cross her path.  I can can almost hear their "wthJUST SPLATTERED ME?" cries.

 

One does not simply jump in Me 262 and figure out Me 262 in one night.  



Mercsn #44 Posted 02 January 2018 - 02:09 PM

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View PostCamuMahubah, on 02 January 2018 - 07:21 AM, said:

 

Those tier 4 and 5 planes you recommend also have maquinas.  Yah so great they also have nose mounted cannon but you do not fly the 262 like you fly 110.

 

In 110 you fire for loooooooong time before gun get red.

 

In 262 you fire shrt time gun red.

 

In 110 you can tank around a cap at all altitudes.(Maybe you shouldn't but you can easy and it's a bad habit the plane will let you get away with.)

 

In 262 you stay high and energy fighting through the cap.

 

If you wanna learn Me 262 you are gonna fail with it at first.  It's taking me some time to learn it and I know I can't jump in my tier 4/5 German Heavy and get the same feeling.

 

They are not fast enough.  P-38 sorta feels like similar play but it has the neverending .50's.

 

I am sorta figuring out 262 and I like it more each sortie but I am still missing many leading shots because I overestimate or underestimate Kentucky windage.

 

Keeping speed and making those 30's do work is a challenge and it should be.  If it hit as easily as tier 4 German Heavy guns it would OP af.

 

Lately when I fly Me 262 I have had bad luck in that the red team has had tier 9 GA' flown by semi-competent mammals.  A mammal in a GA is my nemesis because I'm too dumb to realize they can shoot forward too.  And they can shoot really good backwards.  And I don't wanna be that low in Me 262 but when cro magnons are in such airborne tanks I sometimes have to take them out because they flip caps like acrobats on Ritalin.

 

Maybe go fly Lightening plane is better recommendation.  At least it does give that Zoom and Boom feeling of..."oh snap I can't kill enough in one pass and I've gotta zoom back and stay fast and high ..and zomg this cannon cain't hit a stripe on a zebra...omg I'll get one dive on that GA before he flips iT...".

 

Mercsn is smart guy.  Maybe I just think differently and see world different.  I do know Me 262 is a spiteful mistress who will let you die if you mess up but if you hold the reins just right she will murder all that cross her path.  I can can almost hear their "wthJUST SPLATTERED ME?" cries.

 

One does not simply jump in Me 262 and figure out Me 262 in one night.

 

 

The whole point is to not have the guns get red.  In the 262, you really don't have time to overheat the guns before you fly past or break off the attack to escape, so gun overheat isn't an issue (I took out 4 of an ai bomber flight solo from behind and just hit gun overheat).  The Bf110 is a terrible turning aircraft.  It is better for learning how to handle a craft that doesn't turn well, both in terms of steering the nose to setup a leading shot on a target and for learning how to pick your fights so that you aren't overwhelmed by anything that can out-turn you (which is pretty much everything).  Again, we'll just agree to disagree.


 @OP,

As for the 262 being fragile...I just did a match where my only death was caused by me colliding with an ai bomber (the 5th from the flight I mentioned).  Which brings me back to learning to fly an aircraft that can't turn well being an important skill for operating the 262 successfully.

:facepalm:  Doh!


 

Furthermore, nothing even fired at me because I was in and out faster than anything could draw a bead on me...and that's with the base, stock, not-at-all-upgraded engine.   After the squall, I killed the other team's 262 to keep it that way (well, they had a Komet, but that thing is terrible unless it lucks out with an ace bot pilot: rare, and it's one plane a 262 probably can turn-fight with).


 

Me 262 is a fun plane, but it's like a home run hitter in baseball.  You will swing and miss at times, but when you do connect, it's gonna be a strong hit.

 

 


 

Oh, and that match paid out 29k credits (non-premium time figure) using universal ammo and only using engine cooling consumable (medkit and restarter also equipped).

 

 


 

Oh, and because I like this plane and have a random sense of humor:


 

Spoiler

 

Oh, and full disclosure:  the pilot currently in the 262 is my original German starting pilot. So, he has 7 skill points.  He has both marksman perks and aerodynamics expert.  The plane is equipped with gunsight, polish and engine tuning.


Edited by Mercsn, 02 January 2018 - 03:05 PM.

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Edited, on 12 March - 2:01PM , said:

and PS...play more, forum less.  Your opinion might be more credible.

StoptheViolins #45 Posted 02 January 2018 - 02:23 PM

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Until planes take a bigger loss to energy for turning BnZ will be a major art form.

I mean some poor sod got shot down in his 109z and thought my 109f was cheating.  I want able to do a 180 and wear him down.  He wasn't too smart in the timing of his climbs.  Aka I didn't lose enough speed in my turns to not be able to cross his U in time to shoot him on his climb.

My zero is even worse as it can do a 180 in a diameter equal to two of its own wing spans.  Idealistically such a turn should bleed a ton of energy but it doesn't.

Noreaga #46 Posted 02 January 2018 - 04:48 PM

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well its one of the few planes ive played recently, with the change to meta its not the be all and end of all of HF anymore. I did ok, It was still fun, and with more than 7 games under my belt, i know i would do much better.

 

I can tell you:

it is still a plane that requires practice and patience over flashy  turn & burn (which was basically obsolete by the T8 timeframe).

it is still superior in this game especially with the meta pulling everyone to the deck, you can skim off the top at will.

its guns are the same as all the other guns in the game, regardless of physics you need to be below 400m to efficiently knock health down.

do not expect to kill something in 1 run, most time RNG will not let you do it. 

 

imagine you are flying a bathtub with jet engines and massive cannons, don't use hard angles and keep your speed. 


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HazeGrayUnderway #47 Posted 02 January 2018 - 08:11 PM

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View PostCamuMahubah, on 02 January 2018 - 01:21 PM, said:

Maybe go fly Lightening plane is better recommendation.  At least it does give that Zoom and Boom feeling of..."oh snap I can't kill enough in one pass and I've gotta zoom back and stay fast and high ..and zomg this cannon cain't hit a stripe on a zebra...omg I'll get one dive on that GA before he flips iT...".

 

 

I don't know about the P-38s.  The planes fly like a heavy fighter naturally (bad turn characteristics, long engine boost, etc).  But the armament is rather light.  You don't dogfight in a heavy fighter unless you got the numbers so heavily stacked in your favor.  With a reliance on .50's, the temptation is to engage in a dogfight to kill the target.  But proper B&Z, you do not have that long engagement time.  Stuff like German Heavies which simply LOVE cannons are better for B&Z.  A plane fitted with lots of .50s needs time on target.

 

Of course, this changes once past the P-38s and you start getting into F7F and of course, the Flying Pancake of the line.  The Pancake with the 20mm guns on the nose is very nasty.  I loved my Me 262 but the Pancake could give a run for its money.


Edited by HazeGrayUnderway, 02 January 2018 - 08:24 PM.


Mercsn #48 Posted 02 January 2018 - 09:14 PM

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Here's a quick vid clip of the Me 262 "dogfighting" two J4M defense bots (they like to try and run away...el oh el), then diving on a 3rd bot figher chasing an enemy GA (could replace the enemy GA with a teammate as far as my description of target priority).   

 


 


 

 

 


 


 


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The below was said to me (Mercsn), from a concerned player:

Edited, on 12 March - 2:01PM , said:

and PS...play more, forum less.  Your opinion might be more credible.

CamuMahubah #49 Posted 02 January 2018 - 11:06 PM

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View PostMercsn, on 02 January 2018 - 09:14 PM, said:

Here's a quick vid clip of the Me 262 "dogfighting" two J4M defense bots (they like to try and run away...el oh el), then diving on a 3rd bot figher chasing an enemy GA (could replace the enemy GA with a teammate as far as my description of target priority).   

 


 


 

 

 


 


 

 

J4M defense are ridiculous sky cows in air defense fighter form. 

 

XP pinatas.  I'm not even sure if they are aggressive at all.

 

Beaufighters...now those sky cows will charge.

 

Hilarious how higher tier air defense is easy xp. 
 



Mercsn #50 Posted 03 January 2018 - 12:36 AM

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View PostCamuMahubah, on 02 January 2018 - 05:06 PM, said:

 

J4M defense are ridiculous sky cows in air defense fighter form.

 

XP pinatas.  I'm not even sure if they are aggressive at all.

 

Beaufighters...now those sky cows will charge.

 

Hilarious how higher tier air defense is easy xp. 
 

 

I was mainly trying to illustrate the dive attack on an enemy that's chasing somebody.  Although, the J4m's happened to make easy kills prior to that dive attack.

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and PS...play more, forum less.  Your opinion might be more credible.

CamuMahubah #51 Posted 03 January 2018 - 07:30 AM

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View PostMercsn, on 03 January 2018 - 12:36 AM, said:

 

I was mainly trying to illustrate the dive attack on an enemy that's chasing somebody.  Although, the J4m's happened to make easy kills prior to that dive attack.

 



Zergling #52 Posted 10 January 2018 - 01:07 PM

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Yeah, I recently started playing the Me 262 myself, and I have to agree that the plane is awful. I dunno how it was before 2.0, but in the current meta it is terribly underpowered.

 

I'm not inexperienced at heavy fighters; I climbed my way up the German tree the normal way, and while I found the Bf 109 Z to be rather boring, it was a fairly effective plane.

The Me 262 though? While fast and having similar armament to the 109Z, it just can't get its guns on target anywhere near as easily, which means it can't effectively do damage where it matters.

 

The plane is good at running away, leading a lemming train of bots to nowhere, but I feel that is all it really can do.

 



Onyx #53 Posted 10 January 2018 - 01:41 PM

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After hearing Zergling's thoughts, having played the 109Z myself (NOT the Me 262) had considerable experience in multiple heavies at multiple tiers, my experience is largely the same.  Basically, the break point for being a good heavy is about a 14 second turn time.  Anything above 14 seconds turn time just gets progressively worse the further away from it it is.  Conversely, anything under 14 seconds gets progressively better the faster it turns.  This divergence isn't as obvious in lower tiers, the SE 100 or BF 110 B can be used to devastating effect, but I believe this to be a function of low overall enemy health, low overall enemy speed across all planes, and heavies with long range.  Speed is important, as the faster planes move, the harder it is to effectively hit them at long distances without a lead indicator.  As a note, keep the lead indicator out, the game is better without it.

 

However, while the 262 can be difficult if not impossible to catch, I have yet to see anyone, be it a player or bot, who has truly given me any real trouble on the 262 without me allowing them to cause trouble.  It's relatively easy to defend against and largely inconsequential to the progression of a game.  It's kinda like 190s or P-47s.  They're a nuisance, but not one that can't be easily dealt with with the correct tactics, and one that really doesn't help you win games for having one on your side.

 

Despite this, I have used "good" heavies.  The XF5U is absolutely phenomenal as a heavy, and I attribute the majority of its effectiveness to 3 key attributes.  Good, usable firepower (that means accurate, able to get on target from a far enough range, and high enough in damage), strong boost acceleration, and a low enough turn time to get on target.  It's a 13.1 plane, well below the 14s I say is the break point for being a good heavy fighter.  Planes at 14.4 like the F7F or 109Z are okay, but suffer from target acquisition issues (but at least are passable) and it just goes to hell as it hits 16+ unless you're in very low tiers where you have plenty of time to set up shots on very slow moving targets, killing or severely crippling them in but 1 pass.

 

The net result is that the 262 just lacks truly usable firepower in the current meta.  It's very strong if you can bring the guns to bear, but it's too slow in actually bring them on target, and once on target it's not very usable.  It can run away, but running away doesn't win battles for you anymore, and is actually a downside in the current meta to have "It can run away" as a strength.  How quickly you can turn bases to your side is the single most important metric of the game, period.

 

As such, my actual opinion on any heavy with a turn time above 14 seconds is "This needs turn time buffs, period."  SE-100, Me 210, Me 410, Beaufighter, 109Z, F7F, Me 262 (all 3) XF-90, F2H Banshee, P.1056.  Basically, if its turn time is above 14, it's likely varying degrees of underpowered in the current meta and needs buffs.  After buffing the turn time, its balance can be re-evaluated to see if it needs further tuning, such as to remove some speed or tweak the weapons further.

 

The end result, however, is that most heavies are just not that influential.  The only saving grace of slower turning heavies at the moment is bomb load.  Just my 2 cents.



StoptheViolins #54 Posted 10 January 2018 - 04:43 PM

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I am on the 109Z and have enough free XP to get to the 262 but don't want to skip the 109Z simply because those 30mm's give me fits.  I just need more stick time with 30mm German birds to get used to their slow rounds and fast overheat times.  If I can't use the 30mm's now the 262 will be a "bad plane" for me.

 

I am debating whether to use the J7W1 as a trainier (the 30mm's feel similar) simply because it gives me more time on target to practice.  The 109Z gives about 8 passes before the match is over lol.



pyantoryng #55 Posted 10 January 2018 - 04:51 PM

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View PostStoptheViolins, on 10 January 2018 - 04:43 PM, said:

I am on the 109Z and have enough free XP to get to the 262 but don't want to skip the 109Z simply because those 30mm's give me fits.  I just need more stick time with 30mm German birds to get used to their slow rounds and fast overheat times.  If I can't use the 30mm's now the 262 will be a "bad plane" for me.

 

I am debating whether to use the J7W1 as a trainier (the 30mm's feel similar) simply because it gives me more time on target to practice.  The 109Z gives about 8 passes before the match is over lol.

 

The J7W1's superior handling and lower stall speed makes it ideal for that kind of gun...it just don't compare IMO. The 262 relies on high-speed passes that you may well have 2-3 second tops at shooting the target, you simply can't pull the brakes without risking damage.

WoWP makes a great jousting game...especially with the 262 and people busy in furballs...
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Zergling #56 Posted 10 January 2018 - 06:22 PM

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I spent an hour or two in practice battles by myself, fighting bots with my Me 262, and the plane works fine against heavy fighters, attackers and bombers; it is light and multi-role fighters it struggles against.

 

With LF/MF targets, I find that once I get into gun range, unless the target is moving predictably I will be unable to keep guns on target long enough to do substantial damage (and frequently I will miss entirely).

 

The problem has three parts:

1) the Me 262 has poor handling

2) the guns have poor range

3) the guns have poor velocity, requiring great lead to hit with a deflection shot

 

I'm pretty sure that if the Me 262 had something like 800 meter range guns with high velocity, I wouldn't be having anywhere near as much problems as I currently am. I think I'll work towards the P.1056 next, and see how 6x 20mm on that plane compares with the Me 262.

 


Edited by Zergling, 10 January 2018 - 06:23 PM.


StoptheViolins #57 Posted 10 January 2018 - 08:33 PM

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I am just reading up on the wiki for the Mk 108 cannon and it appears to be designed primary for use against bombers.  The rate of fire is listed at 650 RPM.  Keep in mind it had a short barrel so that it's not a sniper weapon.

Pogo68 #58 Posted 10 January 2018 - 09:13 PM

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Re.262

Don't dogfight.

Climb

Pick your target

Swoop down in a shallow dive, fire at close range, blow through and egress in a level flight.

This allows you to extend and gain separation and get out of guns range.

Once out of range, execute a shallow climb back up and repeat.

 

Note, the 262 is a bomber interceptor, it's not a dogfighter.

Speed and altitude are your friends.

 

Personally, against bombers, I like to attack from the front or the side and slightly above.

A shallow dive brings it to it's max V, and I can hit the target and blow through to the rear and be out of range quickly.

 

Against fighters, I like to draw them into an energy fight.

I try to start with an altitude advantage and keep it.

This forces my opponent to fight with their noses pointed towards the sky.

I avoid hard level turns, preferring wide, smooth, vertical maneuvers.

This exacerbates my opponents disadvantage while allows me to keep my energy advantage and control the fight.

 

 

 

 


Edited by Pogo68, 10 January 2018 - 09:16 PM.

DICTA BOELCKE for WoWP
    1. Try to secure the upper hand before attacking.
    2. Always continue with an attack you have begun
    3. Open fire only at close range, and then only when the opponent is squarely in your sights
    4. You should always try to keep your eye on your opponent, and never let yourself be deceived by ruses
    5. In any type of attack, it is essential to assail your opponent from behind
    6. If your opponent dives on you, do not try run away from his attack, but fly to meet it
    7. When over the enemy's lines, always remember your own line of retreat
    8. It is better to attack in groups of four or six. Avoid two aircraft attacking the same opponent

CamuMahubah #59 Posted 11 January 2018 - 01:10 AM

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View PostStoptheViolins, on 10 January 2018 - 04:43 PM, said:

I am on the 109Z and have enough free XP to get to the 262 but don't want to skip the 109Z simply because those 30mm's give me fits.  I just need more stick time with 30mm German birds to get used to their slow rounds and fast overheat times.  If I can't use the 30mm's now the 262 will be a "bad plane" for me.

 

I am debating whether to use the J7W1 as a trainier (the 30mm's feel similar) simply because it gives me more time on target to practice.  The 109Z gives about 8 passes before the match is over lol.

 

I thought about going back to the Zwilling and I recommend it with 4 30mm if you want a similar playstyle.  I still play the Z but I have found the best way to learn Me 262 is to play Me 262.  I've greatly improved from when I first unlocked it.  

 

Most important thing I learned is to get off the guns if they aren't hitting.  Rearrange the shots.  I wasn't overheating but I was missing the lead from the first shot to the last shot.  If you get off the guns you might be able to change your lead and get one or two in before target time is over.  That took me some time to master.  Lead times change from target to target because if angles, rate of climb, speed, distance....so many variables that my brain would miscalculate and I would miss every shot on a pass sometimes.  Getting off the trigger and taking a better lead was the difference between a kill next pass or needing an extra pass.  

 

Flying the low tier German heavy aircraft with all those mg tracers wrapped around your 20mm or 30mm shell doesn't prepare you for this because you are still getting hit sound clicks.  Most of your cannon hits are gonna be luck at low tiers.

 

Zwilling is without doubt best Me 262 trainer.  Once you unlock top engines that is..

 

As I prefer grinding to caring about stats I stubbornly played Me 262 until my slow learning brain got some clues.  It was painful for about ten games and then it got fun ripping apart unsuspecting peeps in their happy turn fighters.

 

Catch them with their pants down and let them have it  I do say ol'chap!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Me 262 is a good aircraft but there are better aircraft for this Conquest ABC Always Be Capping Meta.  Embrace the challenge. I

 

 



Onyx #60 Posted 11 January 2018 - 03:19 AM

    Master Sergeant

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View PostPogo68, on 10 January 2018 - 01:13 PM, said:

Re.262

Don't dogfight.

Climb

Pick your target

Swoop down in a shallow dive, fire at close range, blow through and egress in a level flight.

This allows you to extend and gain separation and get out of guns range.

Once out of range, execute a shallow climb back up and repeat.

 

Note, the 262 is a bomber interceptor, it's not a dogfighter.

Speed and altitude are your friends.

 

Personally, against bombers, I like to attack from the front or the side and slightly above.

A shallow dive brings it to it's max V, and I can hit the target and blow through to the rear and be out of range quickly.

 

Against fighters, I like to draw them into an energy fight.

I try to start with an altitude advantage and keep it.

This forces my opponent to fight with their noses pointed towards the sky.

I avoid hard level turns, preferring wide, smooth, vertical maneuvers.

This exacerbates my opponents disadvantage while allows me to keep my energy advantage and control the fight.

 

 

 

 

 

The problem with this is very simple.  You just described a quick way to lose games.  Boom and zoom is too slow to make a meaningful impact, and if your recommendation is "Run away after the pass" then that's more time for real planes, like the XF5U, Spitfires, hell, even P-51s as bad as they are, to directly influence the cap faster because they don't have the same limitations as the 262.  Speed is vital in the game, and I don't mean the ability to actually move in a straight line fast, which is the only thing the Me 262 actually excels at.  Setting up a pass, doing a hit on a plane, boosting and running away before resetting to try again is a massive amount of time spent being useless to your team.  Meanwhile, even a P-47 can break for a couple seconds, do a slow turn, and come right back in.

 

So the only way you can use the Me 262 correctly is if you absolutely can get the guns perfectly on target from start to finish and drop a plane in that burst, which is a lot easier said than done.  This relegates the plane to basically being a glorified heavy and bomber hunter with a mix of attackers for funzies while you spend ridiculous amounts of time not actually influencing the battle, especially if those targets don't exist.

 

The plane is emphatically underpowered on paper and based on everything I'm seeing and understanding about how heavies actually influence the outcome of games.

 

Its ability to survive is unmatched in tier, but its ability to get kills that matter towards winning the game leaves a lot to be desired.






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