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bombers bombers not available where are the bombers

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CommanderKeene #1 Posted 18 November 2017 - 12:18 AM

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Are bombers ever going to be available under normal purchasing criteria? Its dissapointing to say the least having to save so long for tokens.

GUNDY_ #2 Posted 18 November 2017 - 12:38 AM

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View PostCommanderKeene, on 17 November 2017 - 07:18 PM, said:

Are bombers ever going to be available under normal purchasing criteria? Its dissapointing to say the least having to save so long for tokens.

 

Disappointment for this game is a huge understatement.


CamoCladWarrior #3 Posted 18 November 2017 - 01:46 AM

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View PostGUNDY_, on 18 November 2017 - 12:38 AM, said:

 

Disappointment for this game is a huge understatement.

 

Amen

Stonecoldelf #4 Posted 18 November 2017 - 02:32 AM

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Bombers are broken AF. You can't hunt em down because at that altitude your heavy fighters and figthers fly like a school bus. OH, and they have super OP guns that will shred you in a few seconds. Basically just ignore them as a target.  They need to be balanced or completely removed.

HazeGrayUnderway #5 Posted 18 November 2017 - 02:54 AM

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View PostStonecoldelf, on 18 November 2017 - 02:32 AM, said:

Bombers are broken AF. You can't hunt em down because at that altitude your heavy fighters and figthers fly like a school bus. OH, and they have super OP guns that will shred you in a few seconds. Basically just ignore them as a target.  They need to be balanced or completely removed.

 

Maneuverability tanks at high altitude but heavy fighters and high altitude rating aircraft can and will get up there to do their job.  The real problem are the high altitude capable planes of your team too busy losing in dogfights against Zeroes and Spitfires at low altitudes instead of getting rid of those bombers slowly flipping your caps.

 

Once at higher altitude, you have to make attack runs.  Speed past and hit the bomber, get out of their gun ranges, turn around with good speed, and do it again.  If you are slowing down at high altitude trying to make tight turns, you're doing it wrong.  Slow too much and you sputter and stall, as well as the gunners ripping you apart.

 

My Bf110, Me410, Bf109Z, Me262 eat these bombers doing these basics.  I see P-38s and other heavy fighters do this.  Mustangs are up to the task also due to their high altitude ratings.

 

A picture of my Me262 flying ABOVE an RB-17, turning to get ready to do an attack run on the RB-17.

 

Personally, I'd like to see more player bombers.  Not just to fly one myself, but to put some importance into high altitude performing aircraft such as Heavy Fighters, Mustangs, etc.  Right now it's all about low altitude furballs where Spitfires, Zeroes, etc. thrive.


Edited by HazeGrayUnderway, 18 November 2017 - 02:58 AM.


StoptheViolins #6 Posted 18 November 2017 - 06:20 AM

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I'd like to see the B-26 get tweaked to the state where it can do useful GA strafing.  But... Right now unless the bomber has the right tail gunner setup they are easy targets if you can get to them.  Of course the higher the bomber is the less likely the bomb will hit in the target circle.

vonluckner #7 Posted 18 November 2017 - 10:30 AM

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View PostStonecoldelf, on 18 November 2017 - 02:32 AM, said:

Bombers are broken AF. You can't hunt em down because at that altitude your heavy fighters and figthers fly like a school bus. OH, and they have super OP guns that will shred you in a few seconds. Basically just ignore them as a target.  They need to be balanced or completely removed.

 

lmbonah.

 

The Blenheim is probably the most OP as it can fly higher than even higher-tier fighters (A6M1 for example). Even then, it has non-existant self defense weaponry and can be easily killed or chased off by any fighter than can reach altitude (most American and German fighters of that tier should have little problem unless it's at flight ceiling).

 

Most important is to just set your attack up so that you're not trying to make some slow stern chase from behind... pretty basic. Bombers don't have a really amazing base pushing potential like high tier GAs (or LFs), and their benefit is more that they can solo cap undefended bases without getting molested by swarms of LFs- instead needing more specialized aircraft to counter them. If they weren't hard to kill then there would be no point playing them. If they're going to try and preserve their health, then they're also going to have to kill the HAA, which translates to maybe 2-3 minutes of [edited]around.

 

It also goes without saying that bombers are free kills to HF as long as you're not trying to helicopter climb up to it from behind. Climb to their altitude outside of their range, gain speed, and then intercept them as they make their next run.
 



madgiecool #8 Posted 18 November 2017 - 12:18 PM

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View PostStonecoldelf, on 18 November 2017 - 02:32 AM, said:

Bombers are broken AF. You can't hunt em down because at that altitude your heavy fighters and figthers fly like a school bus. OH, and they have super OP guns that will shred you in a few seconds. Basically just ignore them as a target.  They need to be balanced or completely removed.

 

sounds like arty in Wot, and CV's in WOWS.

 

All 3 hide away from the battle.

All 3 drop piles of crap from above.

 

Adding a similar [edited]game mechanic to all 3 titles must have gotten some really good laughs in the vodka office. 



HazeGrayUnderway #9 Posted 18 November 2017 - 02:07 PM

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View Postmadgiecool, on 18 November 2017 - 12:18 PM, said:

 

sounds like arty in Wot, and CV's in WOWS.

 

All 3 hide away from the battle.

All 3 drop piles of crap from above.

 

Adding a similar [edited]game mechanic to all 3 titles must have gotten some really good laughs in the vodka office. 

 

Bombers are not a problem at all in this game.  Heavy Fighters eat them up.  By Tier VI As early as Tier IV, high altitude capable Fighters are showing up, spearheaded by the US Fighter line's Mustangs.  Spitfires, Zeroes aren't exactly great candidates for high altitude bomber intercepts.

Bomber Altitude Ratings:

At Tier III, Blenheim IV(e) has a rating of 1500.

At Tier VI, A-26 has a rating of 2000.

At Tier VIII, RB-17 has a rating of 2500.

Some Non-Bomber Altitude Ratings:

At Tier IV, P-36 has a rating of 1500.

At Tier IV, Bf109B and Bf110B have a rating of 1700.

At Tier IV, Bristol 146 has a rating of 1000.

At Tier IV, A6M1 has a rating of 600!

At Tier V, P-38F has a rating of 2100.

At Tier V, Spitfire I has a rating of 1200.

At Tier V, A6M5 has a rating of 1000.

At Tier VI, P-38J has a rating of 2200.

At Tier VI, P-51A has a rating of 1900.

At Tier VII, Bf109Z and P-51D have a rating of 2200.

At Tier VII, F4U-4 has a rating of 1300.

At Tier VII, Spitfire IX has a rating of 1500.

At Tier VIII, Me262 and P-51H have a rating of 2500.

At Tier VIII, J7W1 has a rating of 1500.

At Tier VIII, J8M has a rating of 3000.

 

Hell, I excluded the Tier IX planes that RB-17 should be running into.

 

Another thing that you are also completely wrong... Bombers don't hide.  You know where they're at because they are always flying patterns over a cap to drop bombs.  It takes them a lot of time to flip a cap.  I can flip a cap far quicker in a Ground Attack.


Edited by HazeGrayUnderway, 19 November 2017 - 08:32 PM.


HazeGrayUnderway #10 Posted 19 November 2017 - 08:23 AM

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Blenheim IV(e) at Tier IV is actually very vulnerable for her tier.  Here I am flying my Tier IV Bf109B to take down both bombers.

 

Here is my 109B on the ascent and about to engage the first of the two bombers.  For the climb I prepared for it well in advance and did the ascent in a fairly gradual attitude with 20 degrees nose up.  A gradual ascent is absolutely vital if you want to climb to higher altitude in decent time when you are not flying a Heavy Fighter with long lasting Engine Boost.  Fighter Engine Boosts are way shorter.  Take note of my altitude and my airspeed color.  All in the "white" and not at yellow or red where performance starts becoming affected.  The Bf109B has an Altitude Rating of 1700, this is perfect.

 

A second shot of the engagement with the first bomber as I'm prepping to finish it off.  The fight has climbed to 1700m, right at the rating for my plane.  My speed is still in the "white" and my handling has not been affected much.  She's more sluggish at the turn at this height compared to lower altitudes, but control is still strong and I never had a concern with stalling out.  It helps to have a plane with balls in the engines.

 

About to attack the last of the two Blenheims.  Note that except for my altitude in the "yellow," my airspeed is still perfectly in the "white."  Handling at this altitude was still good to go as before.

 

Again, the Tier IV Blenheims are easy to deal with as long as you got a plane that can get to the altitude.  Tier IV Zero, I-16(i), and I-17 have a rating of 600.  In contrast, Tier IV Bf109B has a rating of 1700!

 

Where things start to get more difficult is Tier VI A-26.  That bomber can climb respectably high where more planes struggle to get to her.  She also flies fairly fast and actually has decent defensive armament.  The altitudes that both Tier VI A-26 and Tier VIII RB-17 are where plane maneuverability starts taking a hit, and excessive bleeding of airspeed may cause you to stall out.  At those higher altitudes, managing your speed and doing strafing runs and gradual turns to preserve speed is more vital.

 

Last note regarding ascents, only powerful planes can go sharply nose up and climb rapidly for any decent duration.  Heavy Fighters are best at this because they have very long lasting Engine Boosts.  If you try this with even a high altitude rating fighter, you will sputter if the time you are doing this is required to be longer than your Engine Boost time.  I can get away with this in the Bf110s, P-38, Me410, Me262 because they have such long Engine Boosts.  If I try to rapidly climb from almost ground level to 1700m with my Bf109B at a steep angle with Engine Boost, I'll never make it and will sputter and stall.


Edited by HazeGrayUnderway, 19 November 2017 - 08:27 AM.


StoptheViolins #11 Posted 19 November 2017 - 01:13 PM

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Those are bot bombers.  Player bombers would simply spiral up to 3000+

trikke #12 Posted 19 November 2017 - 03:03 PM

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View Postvonluckner, on 18 November 2017 - 05:30 AM, said:

 

It also goes without saying that bombers are free kills to HF as long as you're not trying to helicopter climb up to it from behind. Climb to their altitude outside of their range, gain speed, and then intercept them as they make their next run.
 

 

great pro tip!

comtedumas #13 Posted 19 November 2017 - 03:30 PM

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View PostHazeGrayUnderway, on 18 November 2017 - 09:07 AM, said:

 

Bombers are not a problem at all in this game.  Heavy Fighters eat them up.  By Tier VI As early as Tier IV, high altitude capable Fighters are showing up, spearheaded by the US Fighter line's Mustangs.  Spitfires, Zeroes aren't exactly great candidates for high altitude bomber intercepts.

Bomber Altitude Ratings:

At Tier IV, Blenheim IV(e) has a rating of 1500.

At Tier VI, A-26 has a rating of 2000.

At Tier VIII, RB-17 has a rating of 2500.

Some Non-Bomber Altitude Ratings:

At Tier IV, P-36 has a rating of 1500.

At Tier IV, Bf109B and Bf110B have a rating of 1700.

At Tier IV, Bristol 146 has a rating of 1000.

At Tier IV, A6M1 has a rating of 600!

At Tier V, P-38F has a rating of 2100.

At Tier V, Spitfire I has a rating of 1200.

At Tier V, A6M5 has a rating of 1000.

At Tier VI, P-38J has a rating of 2200.

At Tier VI, P-51A has a rating of 1900.

At Tier VII, Bf109Z and P-51D have a rating of 2200.

At Tier VII, F4U-4 has a rating of 1300.

At Tier VII, Spitfire IX has a rating of 1500.

At Tier VIII, Me262 and P-51H have a rating of 2500.

At Tier VIII, J7W1 has a rating of 1500.

At Tier VIII, J8M has a rating of 3000.

 

Hell, I excluded the Tier IX planes that RB-17 should be running into.

 

Another thing that you are also completely wrong... Bombers don't hide.  You know where they're at because they are always flying patterns over a cap to drop bombs.  It takes them a lot of time to flip a cap.  I can flip a cap far quicker in a Ground Attack.

Dude,i fly my Blenheim at 10,000, fighters have to work hard to get there.  With engine guru 1 and aerodynamics expert (which now boosts engine tuning by 40%), I made it to 11,120 feet last night.  That’s 3389.376 meters.  

And I can hit targets reliably with it.  


Edited by comtedumas, 19 November 2017 - 03:36 PM.

Heard on the forum.  "1.9 was a hardcore air combat sim.  And it had a lead indicator"  HAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAAHAHAHAAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!

comtedumas #14 Posted 19 November 2017 - 03:31 PM

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View PostHazeGrayUnderway, on 19 November 2017 - 03:23 AM, said:

Blenheim IV(e) at Tier IV is actually very vulnerable for her tier.  Here I am flying my Tier IV Bf109B to take down both bombers.

 

Here is my 109B on the ascent and about to engage the first of the two bombers.  For the climb I prepared for it well in advance and did the ascent in a fairly gradual attitude with 20 degrees nose up.  A gradual ascent is absolutely vital if you want to climb to higher altitude in decent time when you are not flying a Heavy Fighter with long lasting Engine Boost.  Fighter Engine Boosts are way shorter.  Take note of my altitude and my airspeed color.  All in the "white" and not at yellow or red where performance starts becoming affected.  The Bf109B has an Altitude Rating of 1700, this is perfect.

 

A second shot of the engagement with the first bomber as I'm prepping to finish it off.  The fight has climbed to 1700m, right at the rating for my plane.  My speed is still in the "white" and my handling has not been affected much.  She's more sluggish at the turn at this height compared to lower altitudes, but control is still strong and I never had a concern with stalling out.  It helps to have a plane with balls in the engines.

 

About to attack the last of the two Blenheims.  Note that except for my altitude in the "yellow," my airspeed is still perfectly in the "white."  Handling at this altitude was still good to go as before.

 

Again, the Tier IV Blenheims are easy to deal with as long as you got a plane that can get to the altitude.  Tier IV Zero, I-16(i), and I-17 have a rating of 600.  In contrast, Tier IV Bf109B has a rating of 1700!

 

Where things start to get more difficult is Tier VI A-26.  That bomber can climb respectably high where more planes struggle to get to her.  She also flies fairly fast and actually has decent defensive armament.  The altitudes that both Tier VI A-26 and Tier VIII RB-17 are where plane maneuverability starts taking a hit, and excessive bleeding of airspeed may cause you to stall out.  At those higher altitudes, managing your speed and doing strafing runs and gradual turns to preserve speed is more vital.

 

Last note regarding ascents, only powerful planes can go sharply nose up and climb rapidly for any decent duration.  Heavy Fighters are best at this because they have very long lasting Engine Boosts.  If you try this with even a high altitude rating fighter, you will sputter if the time you are doing this is required to be longer than your Engine Boost time.  I can get away with this in the Bf110s, P-38, Me410, Me262 because they have such long Engine Boosts.  If I try to rapidly climb from almost ground level to 1700m with my Bf109B at a steep angle with Engine Boost, I'll never make it and will sputter and stall.

 

Blenheim (e) is Tier 3. 
Heard on the forum.  "1.9 was a hardcore air combat sim.  And it had a lead indicator"  HAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAAHAHAHAAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!

HazeGrayUnderway #15 Posted 19 November 2017 - 08:34 PM

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View PostStoptheViolins, on 19 November 2017 - 01:13 PM, said:

Those are bot bombers. Player bombers would simply spiral up to 3000+

 

View Postcomtedumas, on 19 November 2017 - 03:30 PM, said:

Dude,i fly my Blenheim at 10,000, fighters have to work hard to get there.  With engine guru 1 and aerodynamics expert (which now boosts engine tuning by 40%), I made it to 11,120 feet last night.  That’s 3389.376 meters.  

And I can hit targets reliably with it.  

 

You guys are also encountering bot fighters / heavy fighters that don't know how to climb to high altitudes, so it all evens out, doesn't it?  Those air defense planes at the caps that don't know how to intercept anything past a certain altitude?  The bot fighters trying to go 60 degrees nose up but sputter and stall back down? 

 

Not the same as players.  In addition, Bot Bombers are what you'll commonly come across.  Player bombers are rare but still dealt with.

----------

Speaking of bots, our team's RB-17s were acting weird and were only circling over OUR Command Center.

I was also using a plane that I rather not dedicate to high altitude anti-RB-17 work.  My new F2G with an altitude rating of only 1400.  I had to gradually take this sucker to 2700m+ to defend our Command Center against repeated Double RB-17 attacks.  Nobody else was defending this crucial cap.

 

It wasn't so much a problem getting to 2700m+, but I had to be careful in maintaining attitude, airspeed once up there because my F2G did not like staying up there.  Bleed enough airspeed and try a sharp turn, she was stalling, EASY.

 

Getting up high wasn't the problem but staying up there is if your plane isn't right.  In contrast, my Tier VIII Me 262 just likes to live up at high altitude.


Edited by HazeGrayUnderway, 19 November 2017 - 11:29 PM.


comtedumas #16 Posted 20 November 2017 - 12:36 AM

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At 10,000 ft I am rarely bothered by anyone, bot or human.  It takes them too long to get there and I take their ability to score out of the equation, they might get me but they won’t score much more than that.  And then there are the Blenheim who think they are air to air fighters.  (And I don’t mean Bleheim Fs). They tend to forget rear gunners under player control are better than their front guns.  
Heard on the forum.  "1.9 was a hardcore air combat sim.  And it had a lead indicator"  HAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAAHAHAHAAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!

HazeGrayUnderway #17 Posted 20 November 2017 - 06:59 AM

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View Postcomtedumas, on 20 November 2017 - 12:36 AM, said:

At 10,000 ft I am rarely bothered by anyone, bot or human.  It takes them too long to get there and I take their ability to score out of the equation, they might get me but they won’t score much more than that.  And then there are the Blenheim who think they are air to air fighters.  (And I don’t mean Bleheim Fs). They tend to forget rear gunners under player control are better than their front guns.  

 

There is also the precedent that even among players with planes capable of getting up there, you have dumb@ss stuff like P-38's trying to dogfight at 600m with Spitfires and Zeroes.  It is a problem I noticed that the planes best capable of dealing with the high flying bomber threat don't even try.  Like my last screenshot there... Corsairs suck in high altitude fighting, but I **HAD** to do it because everyone else was busy scampering off elsewhere and they'd be d*mned if they had to be the one defending the Command Center from bomber attack.  Bot or players, it's like that.

Edited by HazeGrayUnderway, 20 November 2017 - 07:01 AM.


NoLove_NoNothing #18 Posted 22 November 2017 - 11:39 PM

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View PostStoptheViolins, on 19 November 2017 - 01:13 PM, said:

Those are bot bombers. Player bombers would simply spiral up to 3000+

 

This.

Bot bombers fly at their white altitude ceiling. When I'm in my Blenheim 4, you would never catch me that low. I climb to up to AT MINIMUM 2100-2200 meters before beginning my bomb runs. At that height, i can easily continue to climb. High altitude AAA guns have a tough time chewing me down, and bot defense fighters can barely scratch my paint. If i see tier 4 heavies, I just climb to max altitude of 3000 meters and flip them the bird as I putt along, dropping my loads all over their bases' faces, telling them to say to me "Ask Daddy for more."

HazeGrayUnderway #19 Posted 23 November 2017 - 12:34 AM

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View PostSaintCelestine_WH40K, on 22 November 2017 - 11:39 PM, said:

 

This.

Bot bombers fly at their white altitude ceiling. When I'm in my Blenheim 4, you would never catch me that low. I climb to up to AT MINIMUM 2100-2200 meters before beginning my bomb runs. At that height, i can easily continue to climb. High altitude AAA guns have a tough time chewing me down, and bot defense fighters can barely scratch my paint. If i see tier 4 heavies, I just climb to max altitude of 3000 meters and flip them the bird as I putt along, dropping my loads all over their bases' faces, telling them to say to me "Ask Daddy for more."

 

And bot fighters / heavy fighters don't fly to the max potential of their aircraft.  So as I said earlier, it evens out doesn't it?

trikke #20 Posted 01 December 2017 - 03:46 PM

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it's december 1st, and pyan said 'a bomber line might be available in december'

 

i've been good all year, i've got credits saved up...  gimme gimmeeeeee!

 

 

edit:  got the 3 bomber december bundle today for cash, not a line of bombers like i had guessed 


Edited by trikke, 02 December 2017 - 03:03 AM.





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