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GeorgePatton's School of Air Combat


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GeorgePatton #1 Posted 08 July 2017 - 12:53 AM

    газета

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Hey Everyone!

 

This is going to be my place to upload video of interesting gameplay moments, post helpful tips, and host a Q&A of sorts about air combat in general. Consider this my 'knowledge drop 2.0' (I had one of these threads many years ago.)

 


 

Who's This Patton Guy?

 

Spoiler

 


 

How Will This Thread Work?

 

I will have a few rules for this thread - follow them and we'll all get along nicely! Don't follow them, and I will report offending posts for removal. This isn't anything personal - I would like to keep this thread as organized and 'on-topic' as possible to facilitate the educational value of the thread. So, here are the rules and expectations I have for this thread:

 

  1. This Page Intentionally Left Blank
  2. Stay On Topic - Do not fight each other in here, do not belittle anyone here, you get it...
  3. You may ask questions - Anyone and everyone is free to ask me questions here related to the topic at hand (air combat tactics and World of Warplanes in general).
  4. You may not answer questions - If you would like to provide your opinions, there are two options 1) make your own thread, 2) wait until I've posted an answer and then feel free to agree/disagree with my post - again, this is not personal, this is "GeorgePatton's School of Air Combat", not "Everybody's School of Air Combat". Offending posts may be reported for removal.
  5. Do not troll this thread - I will strictly report any attempts at trolling or making things personal here. I'm not here to fight with anyone and you should not be here to fight with me.

 


 

Previously, some have questioned the originality of my work here...

do use illustrations from several available publications on air combat.

do use several ideas that are not entirely my own if I feel that they are relevant to becoming a good virtual pilot.

do not copy/paste information unless quoting a source.

 

My reasons for doing this are simple - sometimes there is an idea I would like to communicate which has already been succinctly worded and quoting such a source saves me time and also can lead others to the source where they may find useful information that they would not have encountered otherwise. Also, illustrations take a lot of time to create and public-domain military documents often have the illustrations I need. It is very rare that I will take a piece of information and post it without editing - the reason for this is simple - real-world aviation is very much different to what we see in World of Warplanes and information does not translate directly. I take information from the real-world and develop a way to use it in the game, with or without modification and then place it in this thread in a way that is useful to others on these forums.

 


 

This Video Will Be Available Shortly

 

Feel free to subscribe to my WoWP Channel - I'll be updating that with interesting gameplay and educational pieces!

 

 

Cheers!
Glenn


Edited by GeorgePatton, 13 July 2017 - 12:47 AM.

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Ace_BOTlistic_Cosmo #2 Posted 08 July 2017 - 01:08 AM

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Good luck Glenn, I'll recommend your efforts

:great:


if the pilot's good, see, I mean, if he's really..sharp, he can barrel that baby in so low [he spreads his arms like wings and laughs],

you oughtta see it sometime, it's a sight. A big plane like a '52. VRROOM! There's jet exhaust, fryin' chickens in the barnyard.


gerr22 #3 Posted 08 July 2017 - 05:04 AM

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Go Glen never to old to learn i say

SOLOSHOOTER #4 Posted 08 July 2017 - 08:50 AM

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something you might find helpfull,for any would be pilot out there,look up 'art of war' and watch that explanation of air combat tactics. kudos for trying to help the community o7.

 



:facepalm:SOLOSHOOTER
 
eject................. and ill leave you alone     o7  

Texthor #5 Posted 08 July 2017 - 01:07 PM

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View PostGeorgePatton, on 07 July 2017 - 06:53 PM, said:

Hey Everyone!

 

This is going to be my place to upload video of interesting gameplay moments, post helpful tips, and host a Q&A of sorts about air combat in general. Consider this my 'knowledge drop 2.0' (I had one of these threads many years ago.)

 


 

Who's This Patton Guy?

 

Spoiler

 


 

How Will This Thread Work?

 

I will have a few rules for this thread - follow them and we'll all get along nicely! Don't follow them, and I will report offending posts for removal. This isn't anything personal - I would like to keep this thread as organized and 'on-topic' as possible to facilitate the educational value of the thread. So, here are the rules and expectations I have for this thread:

 

  1. This Page Intentionally Left Blank
  2. Stay On Topic - Do not fight each other in here, do not belittle anyone here, you get it...
  3. You may ask questions - Anyone and everyone is free to ask me questions here related to the topic at hand (air combat tactics and World of Warplanes in general).
  4. You may not answer questions - If you would like to provide your opinions, there are two options 1) make your own thread, 2) wait until I've posted an answer and then feel free to agree/disagree with my post - again, this is not personal, this is "GeorgePatton's School of Air Combat", not "Everybody's School of Air Combat". Offending posts may be reported for removal.
  5. Do not troll this thread - I will strictly report any attempts at trolling or making things personal here. I'm not here to fight with anyone and you should not be here to fight with me.

 


 

Previously, some have questioned the originality of my work here...

do use illustrations from several available publications on air combat.

do use several ideas that are not entirely my own if I feel that they are relevant to becoming a good virtual pilot.

do not copy/paste information unless quoting a source.

 

My reasons for doing this are simple - sometimes there is an idea I would like to communicate which has already been succinctly worded and quoting such a source saves me time and also can lead others to the source where they may find useful information that they would not have encountered otherwise. Also, illustrations take a lot of time to create and public-domain military documents often have the illustrations I need. It is very rare that I will take a piece of information and post it without editing - the reason for this is simple - real-world aviation is very much different to what we see in World of Warplanes and information does not translate directly. I take information from the real-world and develop a way to use it in the game, with or without modification and then place it in this thread in a way that is useful to others on these forums.

 


 

This Video Will Be Available Shortly

 

Feel free to subscribe to my WoWP Channel - I'll be updating that with interesting gameplay and educational pieces!

 

 

Cheers!
Glenn

 

under who is this guy Patton, spoiler...........I thought the game we are playing was IL-2 Sturmovik  !!!!!

Edited by Texthor, 08 July 2017 - 01:11 PM.


GeorgePatton #6 Posted 08 July 2017 - 02:53 PM

    газета

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I received a PM about turn technique and thought I'd share the question (anonymously) and answer here!

 

The Question:

 

Block Quote

One skill I hope you get into is turning.  I use flaps, brakes, and post up to turn, also yaw and boost after I point the nose up and then down to try to get inside a circle.  Sometimes it works, sometimes a plane I should be out turning, out turns me.  I am not doing something right.

 

My answer:

 

Block Quote

One thing to keep in mind when you're trying to get the maximum turn performance out of your machine is that energy is bled extremely rapidly when you're banked to more than 45 degrees (you'll be between 70 and 90 degrees for a maximum rate turn). In real life, we're taught to increase the throttle as we enter a 'steep turn' (higher than 45 degrees bank) to maintain airspeed and maintain a steady turn - I've found that this works in the game as well to maximize the turn rate. You want to remain in the 'green' zone on your airspeed throughout the turn to get maximum performance.

 

My basic process for maximum performance turns:

  1. Enter the turn with the engine idled - this gives me the shortest distance to the turn initiation point - I don't want to overshoot the area I'm trying to start the turn.
  2. Drop the flaps as I begin banking - I don't want to drop the flaps too quickly or I'll 'balloon' upwards and out-of-plane with my opponent. Flaps increase the lift of the aircraft and will increase the horizontal component of lift when you're banked, thus tightening your turn.
  3. As the turn is established, I'll activate the 'boost' on my aircraft to maintain airspeed and turn rate.

 

Of course, there are times where you want to 'lag' your opponent a little to get a better gun solution later in the turn - in these cases, killing the speed is appropriate so you'll go to engine idle.

 

Some important things to think about when you're performing maximum performance turns in the context of a dogfight are:

  1. Your opponent's maneuverability compared to yours - if they're more maneuverable, think about a lot of out-of-plane maneuvers that will deplete your opponent's energy and minimize their performance advantage (super-maneuverable planes don't sustain that advantage long if they run out of energy!)
  2. Do not bleed all of your airspeed - remember that no matter what, your plane will handle at its' best when you're in the 'green' zone of your airspeed and altitude bands.

 

There's a lot of nuance to turning that you'll pick up with experience, but I think this is a good place to start!

 

 

Cheers!
Glenn


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mnbv_fockewulfe #7 Posted 08 July 2017 - 05:55 PM

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I have an interesting video of me in a stall that didn't quite behave in the normal way stalls happen in the game. May I post here and get your explanation?

Dat nose

knows does doe

mnbv_fockewulfe.png


 


GeorgePatton #8 Posted 08 July 2017 - 06:02 PM

    газета

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Go for it!

 

 

Cheers!
Glenn


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SkyWolf__WM #9 Posted 08 July 2017 - 06:17 PM

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Thanks Glenn
***************Fail to Suck****************

I shall use my aircraft and my skill to slightly inconvenience mine enemies.


Balaise #10 Posted 09 July 2017 - 04:13 PM

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What is the best angle of ascend when you need to go high quite fast? 

What angle is the best trade-off between speed of ascent and energy conservation?

 

P.S.: Your post about turning technique is great btw. I already applied it with success.


Edited by Balaise, 09 July 2017 - 04:15 PM.


GeorgePatton #11 Posted 10 July 2017 - 02:26 AM

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Hey Balaise!

 

I'm glad you've seen success with the turning technique!

 

As far as best angle/rate of climb there three schools of thought on this:

  1. Best angle of climb - gives you the most altitude in the shortest line drawn on the ground.
  2. Best rate of climb - gives you the best sustained rate of climb without regard to distance traveled on the ground.
  3. Get me there now! This is my most commonly used method of climbing in the game and I consider it to be the best instantaneous rate of climb at the start of the match. In simple terms, I point the nose up about 80 degrees (80 rather than 90 as I want the wings to keep a little of the weight so I can maintain my speed a little longer - I find that I get about 200m more altitude at 80 degrees than 90) and activate the boost. I generally level out with 4 seconds of boost left to make sure I don't stall and can build up enough speed to have some maneuverability should I get bounced as I level off (very unlikely for anyone, but still a possibility!).

 

So, as I said, the third option is generally what I'll use directly at the start of a match where we begin the match at around the middle of the green speed band. You lose a lot of speed pretty quickly, but it's the best trade for altitude at a rapid rate that will put you in a good position to begin the battle. Save that 4 seconds of boost to regain your speed once you level out and you're golden.

 

As far as the best trade-off between speed of ascent and energy conservation, I would have to say that it depends on the situation and also your aircraft. Each plane handles a little differently, and equipment can also really change the way your aircraft responds. Things like polish and engine tuning help you retain speed better, and the engine tuning also gives your engine more 'hang' power where you can hang your plane on the prop as you climb rather than depending on momentum to carry you - it's not very noticeable on some planes, but it does help. 

 

In a situation where I have an opponent above me looking to bounce me, I'll climb at a steady rate that holds my airspeed as I climb - I want to keep my speed up so when they dive on me I am able to quickly maneuver out-of-plane and force my opponent to 'reset'. then I continue my climb.

 

If my opponent zoomed by me and is going to stall at the top of his climb, I'll go for the best angle of climb - get as much altitude as possible in as small a distance across the ground. Always remember that you do not want to stall as you climb. Break off your attack as you approach the end of your green airspeed band so you're not stalled as your opponent recovers and dives on you. My one exception to this rule is if I'm carrying a lot more speed than my opponent, I will sometimes fly past as I make my attack (shooting, of course!) and then stall above where he or she stalled, and then dive on them. 

 

So, to make a complicated answer short - stay in the green zone of your airspeed indicator. The closer to the dark green, the better - but you can stray from it if necessary, just pay attention to how your aircraft responds to lower airspeeds. Try going in a training room and going straight up to stall several times, approach the stall at different attitudes and see how your aircraft responds, then try a few times coming close to the stall but not actually hitting it - see how your aircraft recovers at these low airspeeds and how long it takes to get back to a controllable airspeed.

 

 

Cheers!
Glenn


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mnbv_fockewulfe #12 Posted 10 July 2017 - 05:37 PM

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I know stalling isn't very realistic in this game (I can't seem to manage a simple spin stall) I thought this was interesting since I stalled twice.


Dat nose

knows does doe

mnbv_fockewulfe.png


 


GeorgePatton #13 Posted 10 July 2017 - 07:31 PM

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That's an interesting situation - it looks like your aircraft rotated a lot when you were in 'autorecover' mode and it tried to level out before it had enough speed (this was possibly due to player input?) which caused the aircraft to lose a lot of airspeed and stall again. I've never personally run into a situation with a double stall outside of deliberate control inputs on my part, so I would be pretty surprised if this was all due to the AI mechanics.

 

Generally I'll just leave the plane to nose down and build some airspeed before I start trying to maneuver again.

 

 

Cheers!
Glenn


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GeorgePatton #14 Posted 13 July 2017 - 01:41 AM

    газета

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Here's the promised video, btw... sorry, cable guy took longer than expected to come install my new internet... look forward to more!

 

 

Cheers!
Glenn


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GeorgePatton #15 Posted 14 July 2017 - 11:29 PM

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Here's a video showing some good angles to hit GA from. This wasn't created for the School of Air Combat, but I think it shows some useful stuff.

 

 

 

Cheers!
Glenn


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