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Dsembr_Rein #81 Posted 18 August 2016 - 07:55 PM

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View PostZ3M, on 18 August 2016 - 01:33 PM, said:

Haha.....tankers can't play this game?  LOL.  I have 50k games in WOT and play for a top 5 clan.  After only 3 months playing here, I feel I am doing pretty well. My friend Scoobstank is also a tanker and could very possibly be one of the best pilots here and we are still just LEARNING the game.  Ego much?

 

Some people have gone to great lengths to try to figure out this game's dismal population beyond the obvious (WG), and that includes claims that a 3rd person arcade plane game with very shooter-like controls is somehow more challenging to the masses. People that have spent any significant amount of time playing video games should have very little difficulty adapting to this game, as they would any game that has an at least halfway decent control scheme.

Bandet #82 Posted 18 August 2016 - 08:30 PM

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View PostZ3M, on 18 August 2016 - 01:33 PM, said:

Haha.....tankers can't play this game?  LOL.  I have 50k games in WOT and play for a top 5 clan.  After only 3 months playing here, I feel I am doing pretty well. My friend Scoobstank is also a tanker and could very possibly be one of the best pilots here and we are still just LEARNING the game.  Ego much?

 

You can become good at the game, but your skill from tanks doesn't carry over since it's an entirely different skill set required to play this game.

 

I'm happy that you feel you are doing well. It's always important to be motivated, but you should know that stats/winrate in planes turn out much different than tanks. The mechanics in this game make an individuals ability much more relevant to the overall outcome of the game. As a result, the best players in the game have much, much higher winrates than possible in tanks while actually playing high tiers and not just sealclubbing.

 

Basically, a 55% winrate is good in tanks but isn't here.


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Psicko23 #83 Posted 18 August 2016 - 10:32 PM

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View PostZ3M, on 18 August 2016 - 11:33 AM, said:

Haha.....tankers can't play this game?  LOL.  I have 50k games in WOT and play for a top 5 clan.  After only 3 months playing here, I feel I am doing pretty well. My friend Scoobstank is also a tanker and could very possibly be one of the best pilots here and we are still just LEARNING the game.  Ego much?

 

not ego. 55% Win rate is a good start here. Your frind is at 58% win rate. Another good start. The player with the highest win rate that I saw was 91 or 92%. I think you are throwing your ego out by thinking 55% win rate is amazing here and you are still "learning." Talk about ego. 

Z3M #84 Posted 19 August 2016 - 01:36 AM

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You think I am throwing my ego out?  How?  I never said anything about win rate or stats, or even that 55% is "amazing".  I am not sure where you came up with that.  I do have a problem with the "tankers cant play" or their egos are too big.  As Rein pointed out, "claims that a 3rd person arcade plane game with very shooter-like controls is somehow more challenging to the masses".  He is right.  This assumption that "tankers" cant handle this game, is ridiculous.  If anything, tanks has a more difficult metaplay to learn. The implication that skill sets are different is also wrong.  Position, situational awareness, and knowing your weapon is the same across all games. I am still learning the game, 12 games in beta and just started playing this 3 months ago.  At a 1000 games, I do feel I am doing well and progressing.



Bandet #85 Posted 19 August 2016 - 01:53 AM

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View PostZ3M, on 18 August 2016 - 07:36 PM, said:

  If anything, tanks has a more difficult metaplay to learn. 

 

 


Edited by Bandet, 19 August 2016 - 01:53 AM.

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Z3M #86 Posted 19 August 2016 - 02:52 AM

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Really?  Whats the play for a E 100 on Redshire? You have south spawn.  Enemy has 6 meds, 3 arty, 2 scouts, and 4 heavies.  You have on your team  4 meds, 4 tds, 2 scouts,3 arty and 2 heavies. Its a encounter battle. Explain to me the play of that tank on this map with this team comp and this game mode.  Please?  Now, in comparison we can discuss the play of a Heavy Fighter in tier 2 thru 10.  Get as high, zoom and boom, egress, repeat.  By all means explain to me why flying a Heavy Fighter is more difficult than driving a E 100 Heavy.  Thats not saying this game is not difficult, by no means. I like this game, but its not a overly complicated play style.

EspressoForHammy #87 Posted 19 August 2016 - 04:14 AM

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Meta in WoWP is simple as pie. Execution is much harder. Tactical evasion is the most difficult and most useful skill to learn.

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pyantoryng #88 Posted 19 August 2016 - 07:59 AM

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View PostEspressoForHammy, on 19 August 2016 - 04:14 AM, said:

Meta in WoWP is simple as pie. Execution is much harder. Tactical evasion is the most difficult and most useful skill to learn.

 

So basically...you meta less and improvise more.

WoWP makes a great jousting game...especially with the 262 and people busy in furballs...
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Z3M #89 Posted 19 August 2016 - 12:27 PM

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Exactly Espresso.  I am having trouble with the execution right now with heavy fighters.  I always want to turn too early and end up in a turning fight.  Haha, not good. 

Bandet #90 Posted 19 August 2016 - 12:43 PM

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View PostZ3M, on 18 August 2016 - 08:52 PM, said:

Really?  Whats the play for a E 100 on Redshire? You have south spawn.  Enemy has 6 meds, 3 arty, 2 scouts, and 4 heavies.  You have on your team  4 meds, 4 tds, 2 scouts,3 arty and 2 heavies. Its a encounter battle. Explain to me the play of that tank on this map with this team comp and this game mode.  Please?  Now, in comparison we can discuss the play of a Heavy Fighter in tier 2 thru 10.  Get as high, zoom and boom, egress, repeat.  By all means explain to me why flying a Heavy Fighter is more difficult than driving a E 100 Heavy.  Thats not saying this game is not difficult, by no means. I like this game, but its not a overly complicated play style.

 

You just proved my point. You don't understand it. When I had winrates as low as yours I thought the game was simplistic too and it bored me until I figured it out.

 

Who do you attack first? Whats the optimal climb angle for your plane? How high do you climb, it's not always as high as possible. What area of the map do you climb to? What is your ratio of booming to zooming? If you play super safe you will have less damage uptime and your team will become overwhelmed. There are three enemies, two above you one below you, what do you do? Someone is chasing you at your altitude, do you try to fight him or run to teammates, you are fighting a plane more maneuverable than you at your altitude: you don't have an energy advantage, how do you beat him? Do you go for the easy kill or do you save your teammate? You can kill this guy in a head-on, but how much damage would you take if you tried to avoid him and kill him from a safer angle? Is the time required to do so worth it? Will your team become overwhelmed by then? What's the weapon spray pattern for each plane (It's not on the crosshair). Whats the enemy tailgunner's arc. What range should you fire your rocket to kill the opponent in a head on? Do you chase that guy going to the deck that you crippled? How much do you need to lead your target, based upon their changing velocity and the adjustment required for your planes spray pattern (The lead indicator is wrong). Do you go for a quick kill in exchange for letting someone behind you score a few hits, or do you avoid him first and then try to outmaneuver both of them. Do you stay in this location in the map and try to finish people off, or do you sacrifice time to move to another location to help your teammates?

 

 

Let me put it this way:

 

If you try to find and follow a meta in WoWP you won't do well because there isn't a structured ruleset you can follow like in world of tanks. That's what makes it challenging. You load into a map in wot, you already know basically everything you are doing from start to finish. That's not skill, it's memory. Your E100 isn't mobile enough to demonstrate any ability even if you wanted it to. You basically go to one position of the map, know where the enemy will be coming from, and then hope that the rest of your team is less stupid than the enemy team.

 

 

World of warplanes meta is closer to that of a FPS game. You are attempting to compare the strategy aspect to a structured strategy game like tanks. Of course WoWP comes up short in that aspect, it's not a strategy game. Here it's all about ability and reaction times, not predestination. That's why it's more difficult.

 

We have already had this argument long ago with other "good" tankers who were regular players of WoWP. They couldn't figure out the game and as such could never reach the winrates of the top players and thus concluded all of our stats were illegitimate, simply because they couldn't do it. Because, you know, they were so great at tanks they were obviously amazing at planes and anyone else who was better than them couldn't have done so because they were so awesome yet couldn't do it themselves /sarcasm *cough* antioniohandsome *cough*

 


Edited by Bandet, 19 August 2016 - 02:54 PM.

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Bandet #91 Posted 19 August 2016 - 02:10 PM

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CS:GO doesn't really have much of a meta either outside of economy management, and it's arguably one of the most challenging games to be good at.

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Noreaga #92 Posted 19 August 2016 - 03:11 PM

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View PostBandet, on 19 August 2016 - 09:10 AM, said:

CS:GO doesn't really have much of a meta either outside of economy management, and it's arguably one of the most challenging games to be good at.

 

been meaning to ask you guys about that, how similar is CS:GO to the original ? wasted a lot of my uni days playing the original, was curious if i was going to have to learn a whole new game.

 

sorry for the derail.


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Bandet #93 Posted 19 August 2016 - 03:13 PM

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View PostNoreaga, on 19 August 2016 - 09:11 AM, said:

 

been meaning to ask you guys about that, how similar is CS:GO to the original ? wasted a lot of my uni days playing the original, was curious if i was going to have to learn a whole new game.

 

sorry for the derail.

 

Never played original


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EspressoForHammy #94 Posted 19 August 2016 - 03:20 PM

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View PostNoreaga, on 19 August 2016 - 10:11 AM, said:

been meaning to ask you guys about that, how similar is CS:GO to the original ? wasted a lot of my uni days playing the original, was curious if i was going to have to learn a whole new game.

 

sorry for the derail.

 

Still doesn't have iron sights. Still sucks.

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Noreaga #95 Posted 19 August 2016 - 03:23 PM

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View PostEspressoForHammy, on 19 August 2016 - 10:20 AM, said:

 

Still doesn't have iron sights. Still sucks.

 

wow really, too bad. Guess ill look at the DOD remake instead.

 

Thanks.


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Bandet #96 Posted 19 August 2016 - 03:25 PM

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View PostEspressoForHammy, on 19 August 2016 - 09:20 AM, said:

 

Still doesn't have iron sights. Still sucks.

 

You don't need iron sights. Also, two of the assault rifles in the game have a rds or acog or whatever the you want to call it that functions the same way iron sights do in other games.

 

We laugh at the people who want cockpit view in WoWP.


Edited by Bandet, 19 August 2016 - 03:26 PM.

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EspressoForHammy #97 Posted 19 August 2016 - 03:27 PM

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View PostBandet, on 19 August 2016 - 10:25 AM, said:

You don't need iron sights.

 

We laugh at the people who want cockpit view in WoWP.

 

It's not about need. I LIKE iron sights. I also like the cockpit view in the other game.

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Noreaga #98 Posted 19 August 2016 - 03:28 PM

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View PostBandet, on 19 August 2016 - 10:25 AM, said:

 

You don't need iron sights.

 

We laugh at the people who want cockpit view in WoWP.

 

You can't teach an old dog like me new tricks, especially since DOD and CS were the first games i played competitive, i don't know how i would play it without iron sights... unless the cross-hairs have improved.

 

 


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Bandet #99 Posted 19 August 2016 - 03:37 PM

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View PostEspressoForHammy, on 19 August 2016 - 09:27 AM, said:

 

It's not about need. I LIKE iron sights. I also like the cockpit view in the other game.

 

If you want that go play DCS. The only game mode where you actually use cockpit in the other game is pretty much a desolate wasteland. Most people don't want it. If you are worried about iron sights CSGO probably isn't for you, battlefield is probably better choice. None of the maps in CS are big enough for you to need iron sights.

Edited by Bandet, 19 August 2016 - 03:37 PM.

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Bandet #100 Posted 19 August 2016 - 03:41 PM

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Speaking of battlefield... I have high hopes for air combat in Battlefield 1. Air combat was mostly eliminated in BF3 and BF4 when they decided that every infantry footsoldier should carry around a guided ground to air missile. No guided missiles in ww1!

To be yourself in a world that is constantly trying to make you something else is the greatest accomplishment.





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