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Thoughts on the P-47 line


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hvPALANTIRION #1 Posted 04 December 2015 - 09:55 AM

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So I will start by saying that the P-47 is my favorite plane of WWII. So I was really hoping that WG would make it useful but I remained doubtful due to the way 50cal MGs are treated in the game. IRL 32lbs/sec of lead comes from a P-47!

 

I've played the line up to tier 8 now, which is likely 1 tier higher than I will grind when the patch goes live. In short, the P-47 line plays like the F-4U line but with MGs instead of cannons. I am generalizing. To continue generalizing: Both are fast, medium alt, rolls well but can't turn with fighters, and can carry rockets and/or bombs.

 

So what's the difference? They are subtle.

1) The P-47s are damn fast. Incredibly fast. Even slightly faster than the F-4U. And the P-47 holds this advantage at all alts.

2) Climbing? Yeah, big time. The P-47N will boost-climb with a 109Z, and will regain speed faster after the climb. The F-4U is a great climber too, but lags behind slightly in this regard.

3) ALL-alt performance. The P-47s have another advantage over the F-4Us here because they retain their performance proportionally better from a higher ideal alt (2000m) all the way down to sea level. This, with the climb rate, makes the P-47s better at hitting GTs (or GAs) and then returning to the fight.

4) Turning. The F-4U actually turns fairly well, the P-47 doesn't. Both roll well, but the P-47 rolls faster and faster as you go up in tier. Overall the P-47s are similar in maneuverability to the 190 line. You can make someone on your tail miss often, but you will never be able to get your guns on him again until you get range to turn back.

5) Guns. Many guns. Many weak guns. High speed + weak guns vs. GTs = bad. The F-4U line is much better at singling out and killing AAA sites. The 20mm on the F-4Us is also better in nearly every way for aerial combat. The one situation where the P-47 line's guns hold an advantage is chewing up large-HP targets that you can camp behind. Contrary to how I play my 50s with my P-51D I actually put sights on my P-47D and N and it significantly increases effective firepower. I attribute this to the P-47's higher closing speed (reduced firing window) and the P-51's ability to turnfight with more types of planes.

 

I have concluded that the P-47s (and the rest of the line up to tier 8) are best suited to hunting HFs and GAs. Against any MR or LF they need to be used as a HorB&Z, making fast passes at planes already occupied with other targets, then escaping using their speed. Essentially the P-47s are interceptors that happen to be used against GTs too. The F-4Us are true MFs as they can be used against pretty much anything in the sky or on the ground - so long as the pilot knows the pros and cons of the planes involved.

 

p.s. WG, please increase the range of MGs. Cannons should, of course, hold a distinctive edge. But MGs max range should be increased by at least 50m across all tiers.



RedSpartacus #2 Posted 04 December 2015 - 12:08 PM

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P-47 good for hunting GAs, nice.

All planes are good for hunting GAs. In the majority of all battles you have these two numb GA bots where one crashes into the ground and the other flies straight.


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Topsight #3 Posted 04 December 2015 - 12:51 PM

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Too bad this is not in the feedback thread because it would be added to the report for WoWP.

 


20thCenturyLtd #4 Posted 04 December 2015 - 02:29 PM

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View PostTopsight, on 04 December 2015 - 07:51 AM, said:

Too bad this is not in the feedback thread because it would be added to the report for WoWP.

 

Come on man, like that would matter. You've been around long enough to know that NA has no voice in this game....RU is KIng. I'm glad you're still happy to keep playing, but at least lay off the Kool Aid a little.

 

 


EspressoForHammy #5 Posted 04 December 2015 - 03:05 PM

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20th, he's the one MAKING the Kool Aid...

"More fun than a three-legged mouse covered in hash oil."  "This is like taking my p38 through a cloud of loose stools... watta mess."

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IronyAngel #6 Posted 04 December 2015 - 03:38 PM

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Nice write-up.  Whether Wargaming sees it or not, I appreciated it.

losttwo #7 Posted 04 December 2015 - 03:53 PM

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Sounds similar to what WG had said in the blog video

20thCenturyLtd #8 Posted 04 December 2015 - 05:31 PM

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View PostEspressoForHammy, on 04 December 2015 - 10:05 AM, said:

20th, he's the one MAKING the Kool Aid...

 

True that !!!

 

 


tyy #9 Posted 04 December 2015 - 06:43 PM

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don't like the look of these....they fly like heavies but with no cannons to make up for the lowered mobility.....same problem as with the 209v.....you have great speed but you can't keep a target in your sights long enough for the weak guns to take it down....

tyy #10 Posted 04 December 2015 - 06:44 PM

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a plane needs at least some turning ability to track a target

tyy #11 Posted 04 December 2015 - 06:44 PM

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or massive guns to kill it quickly,...these have neither

tyy #12 Posted 04 December 2015 - 06:52 PM

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maybe after the Hawker line WG will finally tire of this 'multi-role' thing

Fog_Heavy_Cruiser_Chokai #13 Posted 04 December 2015 - 07:32 PM

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Never been a fan of the Jugg. Big, bulky, fast but ugly- at least to me. Zero's, 109 (in a efficient sorta way), Oscars, and Spits, at least later models, have always been my favorite looking. And the Italian planes and P-40 but those were "minors" in the grand scheme of things. But I must say those F-84s look very nice rendered. VERY nice.

The (not so) amazing Chokai is back! And he's hit all his personal goals sans one! Seriously though, nice to be back, looks like he game is improving. I continue to try to recruit new people.


DInk_Spinkley #14 Posted 04 December 2015 - 07:42 PM

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View Posttyy, on 04 December 2015 - 06:52 PM, said:

maybe after the Hawker line WG will finally tire of this 'multi-role' thing

 

But the "'multi-role' thing" is a reality. Look at the F-15, F-16 and F-18 and......It's more of a reality today as air forces transition to single types of planes (JSF). Heck the United States is even working on eliminating pilots altogether.

 

There would have been a lot less controversy if Turkey had shot down a drone than a manned fighter.

 

But I digress. Looking forward to the P-47 line.


RIP World of Warplanes

outwardpanicjoe #15 Posted 04 December 2015 - 08:02 PM

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View PosthvPALANTIRION, on 04 December 2015 - 09:55 AM, said:

So I will start by saying that the P-47 is my favorite plane of WWII. So I was really hoping that WG would make it useful but I remained doubtful due to the way 50cal MGs are treated in the game. IRL 32lbs/sec of lead comes from a P-47!

 

I've played the line up to tier 8 now, which is likely 1 tier higher than I will grind when the patch goes live. In short, the P-47 line plays like the F-4U line but with MGs instead of cannons. I am generalizing. To continue generalizing: Both are fast, medium alt, rolls well but can't turn with fighters, and can carry rockets and/or bombs.

 

So what's the difference? They are subtle.

1) The P-47s are damn fast. Incredibly fast. Even slightly faster than the F-4U. And the P-47 holds this advantage at all alts.

2) Climbing? Yeah, big time. The P-47N will boost-climb with a 109Z, and will regain speed faster after the climb. The F-4U is a great climber too, but lags behind slightly in this regard.

3) ALL-alt performance. The P-47s have another advantage over the F-4Us here because they retain their performance proportionally better from a higher ideal alt (2000m) all the way down to sea level. This, with the climb rate, makes the P-47s better at hitting GTs (or GAs) and then returning to the fight.

4) Turning. The F-4U actually turns fairly well, the P-47 doesn't. Both roll well, but the P-47 rolls faster and faster as you go up in tier. Overall the P-47s are similar in maneuverability to the 190 line. You can make someone on your tail miss often, but you will never be able to get your guns on him again until you get range to turn back.

5) Guns. Many guns. Many weak guns. High speed + weak guns vs. GTs = bad. The F-4U line is much better at singling out and killing AAA sites. The 20mm on the F-4Us is also better in nearly every way for aerial combat. The one situation where the P-47 line's guns hold an advantage is chewing up large-HP targets that you can camp behind. Contrary to how I play my 50s with my P-51D I actually put sights on my P-47D and N and it significantly increases effective firepower. I attribute this to the P-47's higher closing speed (reduced firing window) and the P-51's ability to turnfight with more types of planes.

 

I have concluded that the P-47s (and the rest of the line up to tier 8) are best suited to hunting HFs and GAs. Against any MR or LF they need to be used as a HorB&Z, making fast passes at planes already occupied with other targets, then escaping using their speed. Essentially the P-47s are interceptors that happen to be used against GTs too. The F-4Us are true MFs as they can be used against pretty much anything in the sky or on the ground - so long as the pilot knows the pros and cons of the planes involved.

 

p.s. WG, please increase the range of MGs. Cannons should, of course, hold a distinctive edge. But MGs max range should be increased by at least 50m across all tiers.

why dont you use sight on your p-51 i just got the p51-A and not sure what modules to put on it :)



Fog_Heavy_Cruiser_Chokai #16 Posted 04 December 2015 - 08:05 PM

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View Postoutwardpanicjoe, on 04 December 2015 - 08:02 PM, said:

why dont you use sight on your p-51 i just got the p51-A and not sure what modules to put on it :)

I had it before all the additional modules but I would recommend anything that boosts speed. P-51A has four weak guns. Accuracy won't do much. It has a nice top speed though. Basically, it's hard to fix its cons so just boost the pros all you can. No matter what it is inferior to the 109F in, I believe, every attribute. Same for 51D vs 109G.


The (not so) amazing Chokai is back! And he's hit all his personal goals sans one! Seriously though, nice to be back, looks like he game is improving. I continue to try to recruit new people.


pyantoryng #17 Posted 04 December 2015 - 09:29 PM

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The M3 wing has returned after the P-51H lost them...

 

...but no cannons...so much for striking after running outta ordnances...



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HoH_Wolfblitz #18 Posted 04 December 2015 - 09:30 PM

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View Postpyantoryng, on 04 December 2015 - 09:29 PM, said:

The M3 wing has returned after the P-51H lost them...

 

...but no cannons...so much for striking after running outta ordnances...

 

It'll be an interesting challenge. Kind of looking forward to it myself.



outwardpanicjoe #19 Posted 04 December 2015 - 10:15 PM

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View PostFog_Heavy_Cruiser_Chokai, on 04 December 2015 - 08:05 PM, said:

I had it before all the additional modules but I would recommend anything that boosts speed. P-51A has four weak guns. Accuracy won't do much. It has a nice top speed though. Basically, it's hard to fix its cons so just boost the pros all you can. No matter what it is inferior to the 109F in, I believe, every attribute. Same for 51D vs 109G.

 

how did Britain and the US every get air superiority will never know lol

20thCenturyLtd #20 Posted 04 December 2015 - 10:44 PM

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View Postoutwardpanicjoe, on 04 December 2015 - 05:15 PM, said:

 

how did Britain and the US every get air superiority will never know lol

 

Simple, they didn't have WG to nerf their aircraft.

 

 





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