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Change Autopilot (map edge)


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Rarearth #61 Posted 18 February 2015 - 06:42 AM

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Now your cookin Duck . Well not cooking duck ... mmm roast duck , dang what was this about . Borders oh yeah , I say open the borders . Don't like the hit point penalty especially , maybe points off the supremacy meter and let the other team mates deal with the trespasser's lack of awareness .           :hiding:peeking duck .  lol

Heibges #62 Posted 18 February 2015 - 06:59 PM

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View PostChuck_norris10, on 13 February 2015 - 04:45 AM, said:

Stick around and fight like a man! lol! You ran away from your squadron in ww2 like this and you would be in a military court and probably jail for a very long time.

 

 

 

 

 

I agree, which is why other developers who make shooters ensure that hiding is not a viable tactic.

Almost every complaint I have ever seen on the forums has as its root cause the wacky nature of Supremacy.


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dityboycom #63 Posted 18 February 2015 - 07:15 PM

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View PostHeibges, on 18 February 2015 - 01:59 PM, said:

 

I agree, which is why other developers who make shooters ensure that hiding is not a viable tactic.

Almost every complaint I have ever seen on the forums has as its root cause the wacky nature of Supremacy.

 

Except the very obvious nature of superiority in real war. First if you're in battle and all of your wing mates go down, you are not encouraged to stick around and fight for their honor. In fact it is encouraged to bug out if you simply just lose the advantage. So the entire argument is null and void as it was entirely acceptable to run away from your squadron in ww2 if they were all in parachutes and in the dirt.

 

If you listen to most recounts of ace's stories their will always be a part where they discuss sending jr members of the flight back to base when the odds were not favorable, and they would distract the enemy to allow the jr pilots to bug out. Then they would attempt to bug out on their own.



Gang_Starr #64 Posted 18 February 2015 - 07:33 PM

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people here dont understand logic and dont listen to facts dity

Tenks


Tonzzo #65 Posted 18 February 2015 - 07:55 PM

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View PostHeibges, on 18 February 2015 - 06:59 PM, said:

 

I agree, which is why other developers who make shooters ensure that hiding is not a viable tactic.

Almost every complaint I have ever seen on the forums has as its root cause the wacky nature of Supremacy.

 

Supremacy is everything and Honor will only get you killed.....  At the time of Pearl Harbor and the US envolvment of WWII the Japanese had some of the most highly skilled pilots.  Honor and Highly Manuverable / Lightly Armored aircraft got them killed early on in the war.  Before long all they could do is train pilots the basics of flight as send them into battle.  Before long "Honor" meant Kamikaze Attacks:kamikaze:

 

"These attacks, which began in October 1944, followed several critical military defeats for the Japanese. They had long lost aerial dominance due to outdated aircraft and the loss of experienced pilots. On a macroeconomic scale, Japan suffered from a diminishing capacity for war, and a rapidly declining industrial capacity relative to the United States. Despite these problems, the Japanese government expressed its reluctance to surrender. In combination, these factors led to the use of kamikaze tactics as Allied forces advanced towards the Japanese home islands."

 

The reality is the mentality of leave no man behind, Good Tactics, Great Leadership, and most importantly the ideals of "Live to fight another day" prevailed....  Why? Because you cant kill anything after your dead!!!!!  Also who actually think that aircraft / pilots are what wins wars?  Every battle look at the targets on the ground.  Imagine these are Army's and the enemy's "Industrial Capacity" to wage war.  Supremacy is what these battles is all about!!!!  Air superiority helps though....


 

 

 

 

 

 


Edited by Tonzzo, 18 February 2015 - 07:57 PM.


 


losttwo #66 Posted 18 February 2015 - 08:52 PM

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I believe in winning at all cost.

Winning is everything.

Why the frick would anybody not hide and sacrifice the win.

What ? you think losing is fun....GET REAL.

I hate losing.

 

Seriously, You are winning by superiority.

It is you and 3 enemy left. YOU ARE WINNING.

You are going to tell me you are going to engage in a 3 on 1 just to lose the game ?

Or are you going to hide for the win and survive for less repair cost.



Tonzzo #67 Posted 19 February 2015 - 12:58 AM

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I'm going to run and hide!!!!  even if its a Teeny Tiny lead....  Most of the time the enemy will get tired of looking for me and hit GT's and then one crashes....  Teeny Tiny lead just became a win!

 

 

 



 


tanky_the_tank #68 Posted 25 February 2015 - 06:52 PM

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Weird how many times someone crashes and gives you a suprem win when you were gonna lose. I crash sometimes but not that much, loss turning to win because someone crashed happens a LOT.

View Post Traurig_Yoda, on 14 March 2015 - 12:41 AM, said:

another ridiculous remark by TtT.

 


Heibges #69 Posted 26 February 2015 - 01:23 AM

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View PostTonzzo, on 18 February 2015 - 11:55 AM, said:

 

 

 

Supremacy is everything and Honor will only get you killed.....  At the time of Pearl Harbor and the US envolvment of WWII the Japanese had some of the most highly skilled pilots.  Honor and Highly Manuverable / Lightly Armored aircraft got them killed early on in the war.  Before long all they could do is train pilots the basics of flight as send them into battle.  Before long "Honor" meant Kamikaze Attacks:kamikaze:

 

"These attacks, which began in October 1944, followed several critical military defeats for the Japanese. They had long lost aerial dominance due to outdated aircraft and the loss of experienced pilots. On a macroeconomic scale, Japan suffered from a diminishing capacity for war, and a rapidly declining industrial capacity relative to the United States. Despite these problems, the Japanese government expressed its reluctance to surrender. In combination, these factors led to the use of kamikaze tactics as Allied forces advanced towards the Japanese home islands."

 

The reality is the mentality of leave no man behind, Good Tactics, Great Leadership, and most importantly the ideals of "Live to fight another day" prevailed....  Why? Because you cant kill anything after your dead!!!!!  Also who actually think that aircraft / pilots are what wins wars?  Every battle look at the targets on the ground.  Imagine these are Army's and the enemy's "Industrial Capacity" to wage war.  Supremacy is what these battles is all about!!!!  Air superiority helps though....


 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I totally agree with you.

 

This is kind of funny because I have said since Alpha that the closest thing to Supremacy is the way  Hearts of Iron III replicates Strategic Bombing and Trade Interdiction Submarine Warfare.   In those games, to do otherwise would be to probably introduce an exploit where there would be a point where if you built enough submarines of bombers you could  win on the power of those alone.


 

But a squadron of planes moves from point A to Point B, and executes a very specific mission.   Doesn't every military mission, for units on air, land and sea follow the same format.   So folks who make military shooters design modes which replicate the format of a military mission.   Even TDM is Movement to Contact.  Objectives are meant to help keep combat concentrated, and to help organize random teams.


 

I think the problem is that Supremacy being based on a strategic idea, leaves to much ambiguity in the tactical situation.


 

Remember Torpedo 8?  They flew from Point A, The Hornet, to Point B, the IJN Carrier Fleet, and knowing the paramount importance of the specific Objectives, the IJN Carriers, knowing they would have no fighter cover, therefore no protection from the IJN CAP, went on a suicide attack that resulted in the loss of all attacking aircraft, and 29 out of 30 aviators.  God Bless John C. Waldron.


 

The mode should instill a sense of urgency in the teams, and make it clear where they should go, and what they should do.    WoT does a great job with this.


Edited by Heibges, 26 February 2015 - 01:23 AM.

"If the Healer gets killed it's the Tank's fault.  If the Tank gets killed it's the Healer's fault.  If the DPS get killed it's their own fault." - various
 

Heibges #70 Posted 26 February 2015 - 01:25 AM

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View Postdityboycom, on 18 February 2015 - 11:15 AM, said:

 

Except the very obvious nature of superiority in real war. First if you're in battle and all of your wing mates go down, you are not encouraged to stick around and fight for their honor. In fact it is encouraged to bug out if you simply just lose the advantage. So the entire argument is null and void as it was entirely acceptable to run away from your squadron in ww2 if they were all in parachutes and in the dirt.

 

If you listen to most recounts of ace's stories their will always be a part where they discuss sending jr members of the flight back to base when the odds were not favorable, and they would distract the enemy to allow the jr pilots to bug out. Then they would attempt to bug out on their own.

 

 

 

Torpedo 8


Edited by Heibges, 26 February 2015 - 01:26 AM.

"If the Healer gets killed it's the Tank's fault.  If the Tank gets killed it's the Healer's fault.  If the DPS get killed it's their own fault." - various
 

Jyarbro28 #71 Posted 26 February 2015 - 05:02 PM

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An interesting topic and I think a viable option would be, widen the "edge" a little so you have a little more warning and if you fly off the edge at low altitude it is assumed you are escaping from a lost fight and you are simply transported back to your base and you await the result of the battle. If you fly off the edge at high altitude you are turned by the auto pilot just enough to fly down the edge, at most a 90 degree turn.

 

Low altitude would be lower than any of the terrain on the map, so that way you are never turned into a mountain.

 

There have been times when I was the murderous intent guy chasing a kill off the map and when auto pilot grabbed us I was pulled around to right in front of their guns and they were in pursuit of me. Seemed more than a little weird.

 

And if we let this discussion turn to examples of people fleeing or sticking around it will go on forever and have little useful content. But let's use some common sense and figure that a prudent pilot will know that his mates are down and going home to tell the tale would be the smart move. Otherwise there was a time that infantry successfully charged cavalry in Russia and won so we need to have rules that let that happen.....

 

 



SparkyGT #72 Posted 27 February 2015 - 06:16 PM

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random angles would be nice, change it up, keep someone chasing from guessing where you "come back in"

 

 

STUKA =needs a variant with bombs

 





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